Discussion:
Jailed Lula
Add Reply
Quinn C
2018-09-12 18:20:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
This headline greeted me this morning:

Jailed Lula Pulls Out of Brazil Election

I spent about 5 seconds considering how the first name "Jailed" would
be pronounced in Brazilian Portuguese.

--
In the old days, the complaints about the passing of the
golden age were much more sophisticated.
-- James Hogg in alt.usage.english
Peter Duncanson [BrE]
2018-09-12 21:58:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Wed, 12 Sep 2018 14:20:19 -0400, Quinn C
<***@crommatograph.info> wrote:

>This headline greeted me this morning:
>
> Jailed Lula Pulls Out of Brazil Election
>
>I spent about 5 seconds considering how the first name "Jailed" would
>be pronounced in Brazilian Portuguese.

<smile>

--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)
Peter Moylan
2018-09-13 07:44:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 13/09/18 07:58, Peter Duncanson [BrE] wrote:
> On Wed, 12 Sep 2018 14:20:19 -0400, Quinn C
> <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
>
>> This headline greeted me this morning:
>>
>> Jailed Lula Pulls Out of Brazil Election
>>
>> I spent about 5 seconds considering how the first name "Jailed"
>> would be pronounced in Brazilian Portuguese.
>
> <smile>

A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
Incorrectly, as it turned out.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW, Australia
b***@aol.com
2018-09-13 12:53:53 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
> On 13/09/18 07:58, Peter Duncanson [BrE] wrote:
> > On Wed, 12 Sep 2018 14:20:19 -0400, Quinn C
> > <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
> >
> >> This headline greeted me this morning:
> >>
> >> Jailed Lula Pulls Out of Brazil Election
> >>
> >> I spent about 5 seconds considering how the first name "Jailed"
> >> would be pronounced in Brazilian Portuguese.
> >
> > <smile>
>
> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
> Incorrectly, as it turned out.

Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
as JAY-mee.

The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
"Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].

>
> --
> Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
> Newcastle, NSW, Australia
Quinn C
2018-09-13 13:15:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* ***@aol.com:

> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>> On 13/09/18 07:58, Peter Duncanson [BrE] wrote:
>>> On Wed, 12 Sep 2018 14:20:19 -0400, Quinn C
>>> <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
>>>
>>>> This headline greeted me this morning:
>>>>
>>>> Jailed Lula Pulls Out of Brazil Election
>>>>
>>>> I spent about 5 seconds considering how the first name "Jailed"
>>>> would be pronounced in Brazilian Portuguese.
>>>
>>> <smile>
>>
>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>
> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
> as JAY-mee.
>
> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].

Obviously, people do get confused between Jamie and Jaime.

The Jaime who taught us first aid at work made a whole show of the
mispronunciations he has to deal with - but in a charming way. Since
we're in a majority French-speaking area, his conclusion was that if
you can't pronounce it /xaime/ or at least /haime/, then you're allowed
to say "j'aime".


--
The need of a personal pronoun of the singular number and common
gender is so desperate, urgent, imperative, that ... it should long
since have grown on our speech -- The Atlantic Monthly (1878)
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-09-13 13:47:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thursday, 13 September 2018 14:15:54 UTC+1, Quinn C wrote:
> * ***@aol.com:
>
> > Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
> >> On 13/09/18 07:58, Peter Duncanson [BrE] wrote:
> >>> On Wed, 12 Sep 2018 14:20:19 -0400, Quinn C
> >>> <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> This headline greeted me this morning:
> >>>>
> >>>> Jailed Lula Pulls Out of Brazil Election
> >>>>
> >>>> I spent about 5 seconds considering how the first name "Jailed"
> >>>> would be pronounced in Brazilian Portuguese.
> >>>
> >>> <smile>
> >>
> >> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
> >> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
> >> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
> >
> > Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
> > of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
> > as JAY-mee.
> >
> > The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
> > "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
> > is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
>
> Obviously, people do get confused between Jamie and Jaime.
>

No they get confused by Jaime and Jaime being pronounced,
correctly, in several different ways. The most famous Jaimes
(actresses King and Murray, for example) pronounce it Jay-me
so it's no surprise that people assume that's always how it's
said.
Tak To
2018-09-13 15:32:15 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/13/2018 9:47 AM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 14:15:54 UTC+1, Quinn C wrote:
>> * ***@aol.com:
>>
>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>>> On 13/09/18 07:58, Peter Duncanson [BrE] wrote:
>>>>> On Wed, 12 Sep 2018 14:20:19 -0400, Quinn C
>>>>> <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> This headline greeted me this morning:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jailed Lula Pulls Out of Brazil Election
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I spent about 5 seconds considering how the first name "Jailed"
>>>>>> would be pronounced in Brazilian Portuguese.
>>>>>
>>>>> <smile>
>>>>
>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>>>
>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
>>> as JAY-mee.
>>>
>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
>>> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
>>
>> Obviously, people do get confused between Jamie and Jaime.
>
> No they get confused by Jaime and Jaime being pronounced,
> correctly, in several different ways. The most famous Jaimes
> (actresses King and Murray, for example) pronounce it Jay-me
> so it's no surprise that people assume that's always how it's
> said.

The most famous Jaime is arguably Jaime Lannister
(pronounced Jay-me).

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ***@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr
Tony Cooper
2018-09-13 16:14:27 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 11:32:15 -0400, Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx>
wrote:

>On 9/13/2018 9:47 AM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 14:15:54 UTC+1, Quinn C wrote:
>>> * ***@aol.com:
>>>
>>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>>>> On 13/09/18 07:58, Peter Duncanson [BrE] wrote:
>>>>>> On Wed, 12 Sep 2018 14:20:19 -0400, Quinn C
>>>>>> <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This headline greeted me this morning:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Jailed Lula Pulls Out of Brazil Election
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I spent about 5 seconds considering how the first name "Jailed"
>>>>>>> would be pronounced in Brazilian Portuguese.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <smile>
>>>>>
>>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
>>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
>>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>>>>
>>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
>>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
>>>> as JAY-mee.
>>>>
>>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
>>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
>>>> is indeed pronounced as [?xai me].
>>>
>>> Obviously, people do get confused between Jamie and Jaime.
>>
>> No they get confused by Jaime and Jaime being pronounced,
>> correctly, in several different ways. The most famous Jaimes
>> (actresses King and Murray, for example) pronounce it Jay-me
>> so it's no surprise that people assume that's always how it's
>> said.
>
>The most famous Jaime is arguably Jaime Lannister
>(pronounced Jay-me).

Whenever someone refers to someone being famous, and I have absolutely
no idea of who the supposed famous person is or was, I look up that
name.

I did, and I am in agreement with the word "arguably" in the
statement. Very arguable.

I do assume that "Jamie" is pronounced "Jay-me", but I don't have any
idea how to pronounce "Nikolaj" (the actor who plays Jamie). He's
Danish, so my brother might know. His wife's first name is Nukâka,
and she's from Greenland.

I would not like to be the person that has to introduce this couple.

--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-09-13 16:42:51 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thursday, 13 September 2018 17:14:31 UTC+1, Tony Cooper wrote:
> On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 11:32:15 -0400, Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx>
> wrote:
>
> >On 9/13/2018 9:47 AM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
> >> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 14:15:54 UTC+1, Quinn C wrote:
> >>> * ***@aol.com:
> >>>
> >>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
> >>>>> On 13/09/18 07:58, Peter Duncanson [BrE] wrote:
> >>>>>> On Wed, 12 Sep 2018 14:20:19 -0400, Quinn C
> >>>>>> <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> This headline greeted me this morning:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Jailed Lula Pulls Out of Brazil Election
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I spent about 5 seconds considering how the first name "Jailed"
> >>>>>>> would be pronounced in Brazilian Portuguese.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> <smile>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
> >>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
> >>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
> >>>>
> >>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
> >>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
> >>>> as JAY-mee.
> >>>>
> >>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
> >>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
> >>>> is indeed pronounced as [?xai me].
> >>>
> >>> Obviously, people do get confused between Jamie and Jaime.
> >>
> >> No they get confused by Jaime and Jaime being pronounced,
> >> correctly, in several different ways. The most famous Jaimes
> >> (actresses King and Murray, for example) pronounce it Jay-me
> >> so it's no surprise that people assume that's always how it's
> >> said.
> >
> >The most famous Jaime is arguably Jaime Lannister
> >(pronounced Jay-me).
>
> Whenever someone refers to someone being famous, and I have absolutely
> no idea of who the supposed famous person is or was, I look up that
> name.
>
> I did, and I am in agreement with the word "arguably" in the
> statement. Very arguable.

People who watch Game of Thrones assume that everybody on the planet
does too. As delusions go it's fairly harmless. Can't say that I've ever
seen a minute of it. I know some of the actors from other work (Peter
Dinklage, Emilia Clarke, Maisie Williams) but not Nikolaj!
Tak To
2018-09-13 18:18:41 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/13/2018 12:42 PM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 17:14:31 UTC+1, Tony Cooper wrote:
>> On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 11:32:15 -0400, Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 9/13/2018 9:47 AM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>>>> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 14:15:54 UTC+1, Quinn C wrote:
>>>>> * ***@aol.com:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>>>>>> On 13/09/18 07:58, Peter Duncanson [BrE] wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Wed, 12 Sep 2018 14:20:19 -0400, Quinn C
>>>>>>>> <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> This headline greeted me this morning:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Jailed Lula Pulls Out of Brazil Election
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I spent about 5 seconds considering how the first name "Jailed"
>>>>>>>>> would be pronounced in Brazilian Portuguese.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> <smile>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
>>>>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
>>>>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
>>>>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
>>>>>> as JAY-mee.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
>>>>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
>>>>>> is indeed pronounced as [?xai me].
>>>>>
>>>>> Obviously, people do get confused between Jamie and Jaime.
>>>>
>>>> No they get confused by Jaime and Jaime being pronounced,
>>>> correctly, in several different ways. The most famous Jaimes
>>>> (actresses King and Murray, for example) pronounce it Jay-me
>>>> so it's no surprise that people assume that's always how it's
>>>> said.
>>>
>>> The most famous Jaime is arguably Jaime Lannister
>>> (pronounced Jay-me).
>>
>> Whenever someone refers to someone being famous, and I have absolutely
>> no idea of who the supposed famous person is or was, I look up that
>> name.
>>
>> I did, and I am in agreement with the word "arguably" in the
>> statement. Very arguable.
>
> People who watch Game of Thrones assume that everybody on the planet
> does too.

It is false. Not arguably false, not very arguably false
-- demonstrably false.

> As delusions go it's fairly harmless.

Yes, quite so for yours. Thus you can continue to believe
this kind of falsehood without the fear of being ridiculed,
at least not in an environment where not knowing anything
about popular culture is worn as a badge of honor.

> Can't say that I've ever
> seen a minute of it. I know some of the actors from other work (Peter
> Dinklage, Emilia Clarke, Maisie Williams) but not Nikolaj!

/Shot Caller/ (2017) is pretty good, a 7.3 on IMDB and
64% on Rotten Tomato. /Small Crimes/ (2017) is not
bad either, 5.8 on IMDB and 67% on RT.

I can assure you that neither films is widely popular.
Your buddies won't know enough to laugh at you for watching
them.

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ***@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr
Quinn C
2018-09-14 17:53:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Tak To:

> On 9/13/2018 12:42 PM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 17:14:31 UTC+1, Tony Cooper wrote:
>>> On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 11:32:15 -0400, Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> The most famous Jaime is arguably Jaime Lannister
>>>> (pronounced Jay-me).
>>>
>>> Whenever someone refers to someone being famous, and I have absolutely
>>> no idea of who the supposed famous person is or was, I look up that
>>> name.
>>>
>>> I did, and I am in agreement with the word "arguably" in the
>>> statement. Very arguable.
>>
>> People who watch Game of Thrones assume that everybody on the planet
>> does too.
>
> It is false. Not arguably false, not very arguably false
> -- demonstrably false.
>
>> As delusions go it's fairly harmless.
>
> Yes, quite so for yours. Thus you can continue to believe
> this kind of falsehood without the fear of being ridiculed,
> at least not in an environment where not knowing anything
> about popular culture is worn as a badge of honor.

Come on, there's plenty of room between the extremes,

I'm following several TV series, probably about a dozen, but Game of
Thrones didn't make the list. There's so many choices out there these
days, it's a crazy idea that there's anything that everyone would
watch.

Personally, it's not only that there's several other series I'd add to
my list before GoT, I probably never would, because I found it a) too
gory and b) confusing. But even just the ranking argument alone is a
perfectly fine reason not to watch it.

--
Be afraid of the lame - They'll inherit your legs
Be afraid of the old - They'll inherit your souls
-- Regina Spektor, Après moi
Tak To
2018-09-14 19:16:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
> * Tak To:
>
>> On 9/13/2018 12:42 PM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>>> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 17:14:31 UTC+1, Tony Cooper wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 11:32:15 -0400, Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> The most famous Jaime is arguably Jaime Lannister
>>>>> (pronounced Jay-me).
>>>>
>>>> Whenever someone refers to someone being famous, and I have absolutely
>>>> no idea of who the supposed famous person is or was, I look up that
>>>> name.
>>>>
>>>> I did, and I am in agreement with the word "arguably" in the
>>>> statement. Very arguable.
>>>
>>> People who watch Game of Thrones assume that everybody on the planet
>>> does too.
>>
>> It is false. Not arguably false, not very arguably false
>> -- demonstrably false.
>>
>>> As delusions go it's fairly harmless.
>>
>> Yes, quite so for yours. Thus you can continue to believe
>> this kind of falsehood without the fear of being ridiculed,
>> at least not in an environment where not knowing anything
>> about popular culture is worn as a badge of honor.
>
> Come on, there's plenty of room between the extremes,
>
> I'm following several TV series, probably about a dozen, but Game of
> Thrones didn't make the list. There's so many choices out there these
> days, it's a crazy idea that there's anything that everyone would
> watch.

Yes, that is a crazy idea. And it is equally crazy for
anyone to believe that others would believe in that.

> Personally, it's not only that there's several other series I'd add to
> my list before GoT, I probably never would, because I found it a) too
> gory and b) confusing. But even just the ranking argument alone is a
> perfectly fine reason not to watch it.

I really don't care whether you or anyone else in AUE want
or not want to watch GoT, or why.

My estimation of the general degree of awareness of that
name is not based on the viewing or reading(!) habits of
myself or AUE members in general.

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ***@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr
Quinn C
2018-09-15 13:29:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Tak To:

> On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
>> * Tak To:
>>
>>> On 9/13/2018 12:42 PM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>>>> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 17:14:31 UTC+1, Tony Cooper wrote:
>>>>> On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 11:32:15 -0400, Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> The most famous Jaime is arguably Jaime Lannister
>>>>>> (pronounced Jay-me).
>>>>>
>>>>> Whenever someone refers to someone being famous, and I have absolutely
>>>>> no idea of who the supposed famous person is or was, I look up that
>>>>> name.
>>>>>
>>>>> I did, and I am in agreement with the word "arguably" in the
>>>>> statement. Very arguable.
>>>>
>>>> People who watch Game of Thrones assume that everybody on the planet
>>>> does too.
>>>
>>> It is false. Not arguably false, not very arguably false
>>> -- demonstrably false.
>>>
>>>> As delusions go it's fairly harmless.
>>>
>>> Yes, quite so for yours. Thus you can continue to believe
>>> this kind of falsehood without the fear of being ridiculed,
>>> at least not in an environment where not knowing anything
>>> about popular culture is worn as a badge of honor.
>>
>> Come on, there's plenty of room between the extremes,
>>
>> I'm following several TV series, probably about a dozen, but Game of
>> Thrones didn't make the list. There's so many choices out there these
>> days, it's a crazy idea that there's anything that everyone would
>> watch.
>
> Yes, that is a crazy idea. And it is equally crazy for
> anyone to believe that others would believe in that.
>
>> Personally, it's not only that there's several other series I'd add to
>> my list before GoT, I probably never would, because I found it a) too
>> gory and b) confusing. But even just the ranking argument alone is a
>> perfectly fine reason not to watch it.
>
> I really don't care whether you or anyone else in AUE want
> or not want to watch GoT, or why.
>
> My estimation of the general degree of awareness of that
> name is not based on the viewing or reading(!) habits of
> myself or AUE members in general.

I guess what I wanted to express is that these days, a single TV show,
even the biggest one, is not a particularly good source for the most
widespread fame. Other areas may be better for that, maybe music or
politics. Or you have to be in many, many TV shows and/or movies.

--
Press any key to continue or any other key to quit.
Tak To
2018-09-16 00:16:22 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/15/2018 9:29 AM, Quinn C wrote:
> * Tak To:
>
>> On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
>>> * Tak To:
>>>
>>>> On 9/13/2018 12:42 PM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>>>>> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 17:14:31 UTC+1, Tony Cooper wrote:
>>>>>> On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 11:32:15 -0400, Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The most famous Jaime is arguably Jaime Lannister
>>>>>>> (pronounced Jay-me).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Whenever someone refers to someone being famous, and I have absolutely
>>>>>> no idea of who the supposed famous person is or was, I look up that
>>>>>> name.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I did, and I am in agreement with the word "arguably" in the
>>>>>> statement. Very arguable.
>>>>>
>>>>> People who watch Game of Thrones assume that everybody on the planet
>>>>> does too.
>>>>
>>>> It is false. Not arguably false, not very arguably false
>>>> -- demonstrably false.
>>>>
>>>>> As delusions go it's fairly harmless.
>>>>
>>>> Yes, quite so for yours. Thus you can continue to believe
>>>> this kind of falsehood without the fear of being ridiculed,
>>>> at least not in an environment where not knowing anything
>>>> about popular culture is worn as a badge of honor.
>>>
>>> Come on, there's plenty of room between the extremes,
>>>
>>> I'm following several TV series, probably about a dozen, but Game of
>>> Thrones didn't make the list. There's so many choices out there these
>>> days, it's a crazy idea that there's anything that everyone would
>>> watch.
>>
>> Yes, that is a crazy idea. And it is equally crazy for
>> anyone to believe that others would believe in that.
>>
>>> Personally, it's not only that there's several other series I'd add to
>>> my list before GoT, I probably never would, because I found it a) too
>>> gory and b) confusing. But even just the ranking argument alone is a
>>> perfectly fine reason not to watch it.
>>
>> I really don't care whether you or anyone else in AUE want
>> or not want to watch GoT, or why.
>>
>> My estimation of the general degree of awareness of that
>> name is not based on the viewing or reading(!) habits of
>> myself or AUE members in general.
>
> I guess what I wanted to express is that these days, a single TV show,
> even the biggest one, is not a particularly good source for the most
> widespread fame. Other areas may be better for that, maybe music or
> politics. Or you have to be in many, many TV shows and/or movies.

I am not sure what is meant by "source" and how is "good"
measured. Examples please.

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ***@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr
Quinn C
2018-09-16 01:05:15 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Tak To:

> On 9/15/2018 9:29 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>> * Tak To:
>>
>>> On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
>>>> * Tak To:
>>>>
>>>>> On 9/13/2018 12:42 PM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>>>>>> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 17:14:31 UTC+1, Tony Cooper wrote:
>>>>>>> On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 11:32:15 -0400, Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The most famous Jaime is arguably Jaime Lannister
>>>>>>>> (pronounced Jay-me).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Whenever someone refers to someone being famous, and I have absolutely
>>>>>>> no idea of who the supposed famous person is or was, I look up that
>>>>>>> name.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I did, and I am in agreement with the word "arguably" in the
>>>>>>> statement. Very arguable.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> People who watch Game of Thrones assume that everybody on the planet
>>>>>> does too.
>>>>>
>>>>> It is false. Not arguably false, not very arguably false
>>>>> -- demonstrably false.
>>>>>
>>>>>> As delusions go it's fairly harmless.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, quite so for yours. Thus you can continue to believe
>>>>> this kind of falsehood without the fear of being ridiculed,
>>>>> at least not in an environment where not knowing anything
>>>>> about popular culture is worn as a badge of honor.
>>>>
>>>> Come on, there's plenty of room between the extremes,
>>>>
>>>> I'm following several TV series, probably about a dozen, but Game of
>>>> Thrones didn't make the list. There's so many choices out there these
>>>> days, it's a crazy idea that there's anything that everyone would
>>>> watch.
>>>
>>> Yes, that is a crazy idea. And it is equally crazy for
>>> anyone to believe that others would believe in that.
>>>
>>>> Personally, it's not only that there's several other series I'd add to
>>>> my list before GoT, I probably never would, because I found it a) too
>>>> gory and b) confusing. But even just the ranking argument alone is a
>>>> perfectly fine reason not to watch it.
>>>
>>> I really don't care whether you or anyone else in AUE want
>>> or not want to watch GoT, or why.
>>>
>>> My estimation of the general degree of awareness of that
>>> name is not based on the viewing or reading(!) habits of
>>> myself or AUE members in general.
>>
>> I guess what I wanted to express is that these days, a single TV show,
>> even the biggest one, is not a particularly good source for the most
>> widespread fame. Other areas may be better for that, maybe music or
>> politics. Or you have to be in many, many TV shows and/or movies.
>
> I am not sure what is meant by "source" and how is "good"
> measured. Examples please.

Widespread fame is one's name being known by the greatest number of
people. A source for fame is where people know one's name from. A good
source is one that makes one's name known to a lot of people.

A single TV show seems not such a good source of fame relative to other
endeavors, actually for a dual reason: not only is your maximum reach
probably smaller than that of certain roles in music, sports and
politics, even if people remember the face of an actor, they might not
remember the name. In politics and sports, people are known under their
own name. In music, it varies, but many are, too. In movies and
especially TV, the name of a character and of the show are usually more
well-known than the name of an actor.

--
Perhaps it might be well, while the subject is under discussion,
to attempt the creation of an entirely new gender, for the purpose
of facilitating reference to the growing caste of manly women and
womanly men. -- Baltimore Sun (1910)
RHDraney
2018-09-16 02:03:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/15/2018 6:05 PM, Quinn C wrote:
>
> Widespread fame is one's name being known by the greatest number of
> people. A source for fame is where people know one's name from. A good
> source is one that makes one's name known to a lot of people.
>
> A single TV show seems not such a good source of fame relative to other
> endeavors, actually for a dual reason: not only is your maximum reach
> probably smaller than that of certain roles in music, sports and
> politics, even if people remember the face of an actor, they might not
> remember the name. In politics and sports, people are known under their
> own name. In music, it varies, but many are, too. In movies and
> especially TV, the name of a character and of the show are usually more
> well-known than the name of an actor.

*Real* fame in entertainment is when you're known for a single iconic
performance, but everybody refers to that performance by the name of the
actor and nobody can remember the character's name at all....

Yes, I'm talking about you, Ann Darrow!...r
Anders D. Nygaard
2018-09-17 21:27:49 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Den 16-09-2018 kl. 04:03 skrev RHDraney:
> On 9/15/2018 6:05 PM, Quinn C wrote:
>>
>> Widespread fame is one's name being known by the greatest number of
>> people. A source for fame is where people know one's name from. A good
>> source is one that makes one's name known to a lot of people.
>>
>> A single TV show seems not such a good source of fame relative to other
>> endeavors, actually for a dual reason: not only is your maximum reach
>> probably smaller than that of certain roles in music, sports and
>> politics, even if people remember the face of an actor, they might not
>> remember the name. In politics and sports, people are known under their
>> own name. In music, it varies, but many are, too. In movies and
>> especially TV, the name of a character and of the show are usually more
>> well-known than the name of an actor.
>
> *Real* fame in entertainment is when you're known for a single iconic
> performance, but everybody refers to that performance by the name of the
> actor and nobody can remember the character's name at all....
>
> Yes, I'm talking about you, Ann Darrow!...r

Joel Grey?

/Anders, Denmark.
Tak To
2018-09-13 21:57:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/13/2018 4:20 PM, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 12:42:53 PM UTC-4, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 17:14:31 UTC+1, Tony Cooper wrote:
>>> On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 11:32:15 -0400, Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx>
>>> wrote:
>
>>>> The most famous Jaime is arguably Jaime Lannister
>>>> (pronounced Jay-me).
>>> Whenever someone refers to someone being famous, and I have absolutely
>>> no idea of who the supposed famous person is or was, I look up that
>>> name.
>>> I did, and I am in agreement with the word "arguably" in the
>>> statement. Very arguable.
>>
>> People who watch Game of Thrones assume that everybody on the planet
>> does too. As delusions go it's fairly harmless. Can't say that I've ever
>> seen a minute of it. I know some of the actors from other work (Peter
>> Dinklage, Emilia Clarke, Maisie Williams) but not Nikolaj!
>
> I surmised that was the reference.
>
> One thing non-watchers know about GoT is that they regularly kill off
> beloved characters; but I suspect that Mr. Dinklage's character will
> not be killed off, simply because he is a little person -- the reverse
> of when you saw a black guy in a war or SF movie, you knew he would
> soon be the first victim. (Except Night of the Living Dead.)
>
> When he hosted SNL, there was not a single little person joke; and one
> sketch sort of took advantage of his diminutive stature but otherwise
> he was just an ordinary guy.
>
> Contrast *Seinfeld*, where a recurring character was Kramer's little buddy.
> They found ways to make little person jokes that were not offensive but
> did make reference to his size.

Peter Dinklage played an obnoxious character in the comedy
/Elf/ (2003, IMDB 6.9) starring Will Ferrell. Ferrell
played a man-child type character raised by real elves in
the North Pole and somehow wound up in NYC. When he saw
PD's character, he thought the latter was an elf and asked
if he has borrowed a reindeer to come down. PD's character
blew up.

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ***@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr
RHDraney
2018-09-14 06:15:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/13/2018 2:57 PM, Tak To wrote:
>
> Peter Dinklage played an obnoxious character in the comedy
> /Elf/ (2003, IMDB 6.9) starring Will Ferrell. Ferrell
> played a man-child type character raised by real elves in
> the North Pole and somehow wound up in NYC. When he saw
> PD's character, he thought the latter was an elf and asked
> if he has borrowed a reindeer to come down. PD's character
> blew up.

He also played the villain Simon Bar Sinister in the live-action/CGI
"Underdog" movie, as obnoxious as a supervillain must naturally be
(Jason Lee voiced the title character, and Bar Sinister's muscular but
dimwitted henchman Cad was played by Patrick Warburton)...Dinklage was
similarly obnoxious in "Pixels" (let out of prison to fight the aliens
because of his hacking skills and horrifically self-centered), but one
of the good guys nonetheless....r
Peter T. Daniels
2018-09-14 12:18:54 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 2:16:13 AM UTC-4, RHDraney wrote:
> On 9/13/2018 2:57 PM, Tak To wrote:

> > Peter Dinklage played an obnoxious character in the comedy
> > /Elf/ (2003, IMDB 6.9) starring Will Ferrell. Ferrell
> > played a man-child type character raised by real elves in
> > the North Pole and somehow wound up in NYC. When he saw
> > PD's character, he thought the latter was an elf and asked
> > if he has borrowed a reindeer to come down. PD's character
> > blew up.
>
> He also played the villain Simon Bar Sinister in the live-action/CGI
> "Underdog" movie, as obnoxious as a supervillain must naturally be
> (Jason Lee voiced the title character, and Bar Sinister's muscular but
> dimwitted henchman Cad was played by Patrick Warburton)...Dinklage was
> similarly obnoxious in "Pixels" (let out of prison to fight the aliens
> because of his hacking skills and horrifically self-centered), but one
> of the good guys nonetheless....r

That's the character that came across in his SNL monologue.

And the first piece (film, not live) was an incomprehensible nude frolic
in the forest with Leslie Jones, who did her usual one-note character of
the lecher eager for interracial sex. GoT is notorious for nude scenes --
has he done some there? or is it only female nudity anyway?
Tak To
2018-09-14 14:09:33 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/14/2018 8:18 AM, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 2:16:13 AM UTC-4, RHDraney wrote:
>> On 9/13/2018 2:57 PM, Tak To wrote:
>
>>> Peter Dinklage played an obnoxious character in the comedy
>>> /Elf/ (2003, IMDB 6.9) starring Will Ferrell. Ferrell
>>> played a man-child type character raised by real elves in
>>> the North Pole and somehow wound up in NYC. When he saw
>>> PD's character, he thought the latter was an elf and asked
>>> if he has borrowed a reindeer to come down. PD's character
>>> blew up.
>>
>> He also played the villain Simon Bar Sinister in the live-action/CGI
>> "Underdog" movie, as obnoxious as a supervillain must naturally be
>> (Jason Lee voiced the title character, and Bar Sinister's muscular but
>> dimwitted henchman Cad was played by Patrick Warburton)...Dinklage was
>> similarly obnoxious in "Pixels" (let out of prison to fight the aliens
>> because of his hacking skills and horrifically self-centered), but one
>> of the good guys nonetheless....r
>
> That's the character that came across in his SNL monologue.
>
> And the first piece (film, not live) was an incomprehensible nude frolic
> in the forest with Leslie Jones, who did her usual one-note character of
> the lecher eager for interracial sex. GoT is notorious for nude scenes --
> has he done some there? or is it only female nudity anyway?

I watch GoT mainly to fill in the gaps where the
books are not clear or have not covered. His character,
Tyrian Lannister, is supposed to have a normal size
penis and frequent brothels. I haven't seen any nude
scene of his.

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ***@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr
Quinn C
2018-09-14 17:53:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Peter T. Daniels:

[Peter Dinklage]

> That's the character that came across in his SNL monologue.
>
> And the first piece (film, not live) was an incomprehensible nude frolic
> in the forest with Leslie Jones, who did her usual one-note character of
> the lecher eager for interracial sex.

I had to re-read that at lest three times, because I don't know Leslie
Jones, Leslie is a unisex name, and it's highly unusual to describe a
woman as "lecher". If it fits, I'm all for it, of course.

--
The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
whole thread about it.
Peter T. Daniels
2018-09-14 18:28:03 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 1:53:43 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
> * Peter T. Daniels:
>
> [Peter Dinklage]
>
> > That's the character that came across in his SNL monologue.
> >
> > And the first piece (film, not live) was an incomprehensible nude frolic
> > in the forest with Leslie Jones, who did her usual one-note character of
> > the lecher eager for interracial sex.
>
> I had to re-read that at lest three times, because I don't know Leslie
> Jones, Leslie is a unisex name, and it's highly unusual to describe a
> woman as "lecher". If it fits, I'm all for it, of course.

She gets less and less air time, because her range seems so limited --
toward the end of last season, almost her entire shtick was to do a
commentary during Weekend Update on which she flirted harassfully
with Colin Jost. Yet Lorne Michaels is presumably reluctant to let her
go, because it had been a very big deal that SNL had no black women in
the cast, but no one else seems interested -- contrast Sasheer Zameda,
who did about 1 1/2 seasons and is already being cast in major movie
or TV roles (it can be hard to tell what to call some of the digital
services' projects ...)
RHDraney
2018-09-15 01:25:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/14/2018 10:53 AM, Quinn C wrote:

> I had to re-read that at lest three times, because I don't know Leslie
> Jones, Leslie is a unisex name, and it's highly unusual to describe a
> woman as "lecher". If it fits, I'm all for it, of course.
>
> -- The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make
> a whole thread about it.

Not unless that thread involves rotating speakers....r
Peter T. Daniels
2018-09-15 02:54:36 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 9:25:44 PM UTC-4, RHDraney wrote:
> On 9/14/2018 10:53 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>
> > I had to re-read that at lest three times, because I don't know Leslie
> > Jones, Leslie is a unisex name, and it's highly unusual to describe a
> > woman as "lecher". If it fits, I'm all for it, of course.
> >
> > -- The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make
> > a whole thread about it.
>
> Not unless that thread involves rotating speakers....r

And don't forget Joan Leslie!
Kerr-Mudd,John
2018-09-15 08:01:33 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 01:25:13 GMT, RHDraney <***@cox.net> wrote:

> On 9/14/2018 10:53 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>
>> I had to re-read that at lest three times, because I don't know Leslie
>> Jones, Leslie is a unisex name, and it's highly unusual to describe a
>> woman as "lecher". If it fits, I'm all for it, of course.
>>
>> -- The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't
make
>> a whole thread about it.

"Oh, I say!"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Phillips

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Howard
[]

--
Bah, and indeed, Humbug.
Peter Duncanson [BrE]
2018-09-15 11:35:20 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 08:01:33 -0000 (UTC), "Kerr-Mudd,John"
<***@invalid.org> wrote:

>On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 01:25:13 GMT, RHDraney <***@cox.net> wrote:
>
>> On 9/14/2018 10:53 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>>
>>> I had to re-read that at lest three times, because I don't know Leslie
>>> Jones, Leslie is a unisex name, and it's highly unusual to describe a
>>> woman as "lecher". If it fits, I'm all for it, of course.
>>>
>>> -- The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't
>make
>>> a whole thread about it.
>
>"Oh, I say!"
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Phillips
>
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Howard
>[]

Yes.

In my earlier years Leslie was always a male name and Lesley was female.

--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2018-09-15 15:33:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 2018-09-15 11:35:20 +0000, Peter Duncanson [BrE] said:

> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 08:01:33 -0000 (UTC), "Kerr-Mudd,John"
> <***@invalid.org> wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 01:25:13 GMT, RHDraney <***@cox.net> wrote:
>>
>>> On 9/14/2018 10:53 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>>>
>>>> I had to re-read that at lest three times, because I don't know Leslie
>>>> Jones, Leslie is a unisex name, and it's highly unusual to describe a
>>>> woman as "lecher". If it fits, I'm all for it, of course.
>>>>
>>>> -- The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please
>>>> don't>make>>> a whole thread about it.
>>
>> "Oh, I say!"
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Phillips
>>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Howard
>> []
>
> Yes.
>
> In my earlier years Leslie was always a male name and Lesley was female.

+1


--
athel
Kerr-Mudd,John
2018-09-15 17:10:15 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 15:33:02 GMT, Athel Cornish-Bowden
<***@imm.cnrs.fr> wrote:

> On 2018-09-15 11:35:20 +0000, Peter Duncanson [BrE] said:
>
>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 08:01:33 -0000 (UTC), "Kerr-Mudd,John"
>> <***@invalid.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 01:25:13 GMT, RHDraney <***@cox.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 9/14/2018 10:53 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I had to re-read that at lest three times, because I don't know
>>>>> Leslie Jones, Leslie is a unisex name, and it's highly unusual to
>>>>> describe a woman as "lecher". If it fits, I'm all for it, of
>>>>> course.
>>>>>
>>>>> -- The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please
>>>>> don't>make>>> a whole thread about it.
>>>
>>> "Oh, I say!"
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Phillips
>>>
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Howard
>>> []
>>
>> Yes.
>>
>> In my earlier years Leslie was always a male name and Lesley was
>> female.
>
> +1
>
Ladies with first name Lesley, that I feel some may have heard of:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lesley_Judd
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lesley_Waters
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lesley_Gore
Not a lady:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lesley_Vainikolo

--
Bah, and indeed, Humbug.
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2018-09-18 08:44:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 2018-09-15 17:10:15 +0000, Kerr-Mudd,John said:

> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 15:33:02 GMT, Athel Cornish-Bowden
> <***@imm.cnrs.fr> wrote:
>
>> On 2018-09-15 11:35:20 +0000, Peter Duncanson [BrE] said:
>>
>>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 08:01:33 -0000 (UTC), "Kerr-Mudd,John"
>>> <***@invalid.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 01:25:13 GMT, RHDraney <***@cox.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 9/14/2018 10:53 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I had to re-read that at lest three times, because I don't know
>>>>>> Leslie Jones, Leslie is a unisex name, and it's highly unusual to
>>>>>> describe a woman as "lecher". If it fits, I'm all for it, of
>>>>>> course.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -- The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please
>>>>>> don't>make>>> a whole thread about it.
>>>>
>>>> "Oh, I say!"
>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Phillips
>>>>
>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Howard
>>>> []
>>>
>>> Yes.
>>>
>>> In my earlier years Leslie was always a male name and Lesley was
>>> female.
>>
>> +1
>>
> Ladies with first name Lesley, that I feel some may have heard of:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lesley_Judd
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lesley_Waters
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lesley_Gore
> Not a lady:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lesley_Vainikolo

I can't say I've heard of any of them (though I share a birthday with
one of them).


--
athel
Tak To
2018-09-15 22:04:20 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/15/2018 11:33 AM, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> On 2018-09-15 11:35:20 +0000, Peter Duncanson [BrE] said:
>
>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 08:01:33 -0000 (UTC), "Kerr-Mudd,John"
>> <***@invalid.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 01:25:13 GMT, RHDraney <***@cox.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 9/14/2018 10:53 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I had to re-read that at lest three times, because I don't know Leslie
>>>>> Jones, Leslie is a unisex name, and it's highly unusual to describe a
>>>>> woman as "lecher". If it fits, I'm all for it, of course.
>>>>>
>>>>> -- The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please
>>>>> don't>make>>> a whole thread about it.
>>>
>>> "Oh, I say!"
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Phillips
>>>
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Howard
>>> []
>>
>> Yes.
>>
>> In my earlier years Leslie was always a male name and Lesley was female.
>
> +1

+1 with notable exception in the case of Leslie Caron;
but then she was French.

For some reason her name completely escaped my mind.

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ***@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr
Peter T. Daniels
2018-09-16 03:23:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 6:04:25 PM UTC-4, Tak To wrote:
> On 9/15/2018 11:33 AM, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> > On 2018-09-15 11:35:20 +0000, Peter Duncanson [BrE] said:

> >> In my earlier years Leslie was always a male name and Lesley was female.
> > +1
>
> +1 with notable exception in the case of Leslie Caron;
> but then she was French.

Still is. "Born
Leslie Claire Margaret Caron
1 July 1931"

NB Margaret not Marguerite

> For some reason her name completely escaped my mind
Tak To
2018-09-16 09:05:27 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/15/2018 11:23 PM, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 6:04:25 PM UTC-4, Tak To wrote:
>> On 9/15/2018 11:33 AM, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>>> On 2018-09-15 11:35:20 +0000, Peter Duncanson [BrE] said:
>
>>>> In my earlier years Leslie was always a male name and Lesley was female.
>>> +1
>>
>> +1 with notable exception in the case of Leslie Caron;
>> but then she was French.
>
> Still is. "Born
> Leslie Claire Margaret Caron
> 1 July 1931"

I had the (wrong) impression that she has passed away.

> NB Margaret not Marguerite
>
>> For some reason her name completely escaped my mind

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ***@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-09-16 11:01:21 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Sunday, 16 September 2018 10:05:29 UTC+1, Tak To wrote:
> On 9/15/2018 11:23 PM, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> > On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 6:04:25 PM UTC-4, Tak To wrote:
> >> On 9/15/2018 11:33 AM, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> >>> On 2018-09-15 11:35:20 +0000, Peter Duncanson [BrE] said:
> >
> >>>> In my earlier years Leslie was always a male name and Lesley was female.
> >>> +1
> >>
> >> +1 with notable exception in the case of Leslie Caron;
> >> but then she was French.
> >
> > Still is. "Born
> > Leslie Claire Margaret Caron
> > 1 July 1931"
>
> I had the (wrong) impression that she has passed away.
>

Still working. Pops up in The Durrells as Countess Mavrodaki at
least once a season.
Quinn C
2018-09-16 00:34:45 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Athel Cornish-Bowden:

> On 2018-09-15 11:35:20 +0000, Peter Duncanson [BrE] said:
>
>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 08:01:33 -0000 (UTC), "Kerr-Mudd,John"
>> <***@invalid.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 01:25:13 GMT, RHDraney <***@cox.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 9/14/2018 10:53 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I had to re-read that at lest three times, because I don't know Leslie
>>>>> Jones, Leslie is a unisex name, and it's highly unusual to describe a
>>>>> woman as "lecher". If it fits, I'm all for it, of course.
>>>>>
>>>>> -- The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please
>>>>> don't>make>>> a whole thread about it.
>>>
>>> "Oh, I say!"
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Phillips
>>>
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Howard
>>> []
>>
>> Yes.
>>
>> In my earlier years Leslie was always a male name and Lesley was female.
>
> +1

The male/female by spelling thing seems to work well for the French,
where the rule is pretty clear - add an e to make a name female.

Germans don't seem to like that. Where they imported French names that
have the two versions, only one of them is widely used. André and René
only in the male version, Désirée only in the female one.

In English, it doesn't seem to work well, and eventually fall apart,
probably in part because the rules are so arbitrary - compare the above
"Leslie male, Lesley female" with "Jody male, Jodie female".

--
Performance: A statement of the speed at which a computer system
works. Or rather, might work under certain circumstances. Or was
rumored to be working over in Jersey about a month ago.

Disclaimer: I, Quinn, don't believe this is a fair assessment of
performance testing in general
charles
2018-09-16 08:19:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
In article <3y6kd9f3mn1h$***@mid.crommatograph.info>, Quinn C
<***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
> * Athel Cornish-Bowden:

> > On 2018-09-15 11:35:20 +0000, Peter Duncanson [BrE] said:
> >
> >> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 08:01:33 -0000 (UTC), "Kerr-Mudd,John"
> >> <***@invalid.org> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 01:25:13 GMT, RHDraney <***@cox.net> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> On 9/14/2018 10:53 AM, Quinn C wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> I had to re-read that at lest three times, because I don't know
> >>>>> Leslie Jones, Leslie is a unisex name, and it's highly unusual to
> >>>>> describe a woman as "lecher". If it fits, I'm all for it, of course.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -- The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please
> >>>>> don't>make>>> a whole thread about it.
> >>>
> >>> "Oh, I say!" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Phillips
> >>>
> >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Howard []
> >>
> >> Yes.
> >>
> >> In my earlier years Leslie was always a male name and Lesley was
> >> female.
> >
> > +1

> The male/female by spelling thing seems to work well for the French,
> where the rule is pretty clear - add an e to make a name female.

diden't work with my daughter "Jo" - you add an e for the male version.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-09-16 10:56:59 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Sunday, 16 September 2018 09:22:02 UTC+1, charles wrote:
> In article <3y6kd9f3mn1h$***@mid.crommatograph.info>, Quinn C
> <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
> > * Athel Cornish-Bowden:
>
> > > On 2018-09-15 11:35:20 +0000, Peter Duncanson [BrE] said:
> > >
> > >> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 08:01:33 -0000 (UTC), "Kerr-Mudd,John"
> > >> <***@invalid.org> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> On Sat, 15 Sep 2018 01:25:13 GMT, RHDraney <***@cox.net> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>> On 9/14/2018 10:53 AM, Quinn C wrote:
> > >>>>
> > >>>>> I had to re-read that at lest three times, because I don't know
> > >>>>> Leslie Jones, Leslie is a unisex name, and it's highly unusual to
> > >>>>> describe a woman as "lecher". If it fits, I'm all for it, of course.
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> -- The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please
> > >>>>> don't>make>>> a whole thread about it.
> > >>>
> > >>> "Oh, I say!" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Phillips
> > >>>
> > >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Howard []
> > >>
> > >> Yes.
> > >>
> > >> In my earlier years Leslie was always a male name and Lesley was
> > >> female.
> > >
> > > +1
>
> > The male/female by spelling thing seems to work well for the French,
> > where the rule is pretty clear - add an e to make a name female.
>
> diden't work with my daughter "Jo" - you add an e for the male version.
>

Doesn't work with many French names either, unless there's a crop
of Jeane, Pierree, Alberte, Gabriele, Adame, and Alexandree that's
popped up while I wasn't watching.
Peter Moylan
2018-09-16 11:17:52 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 16/09/18 18:19, charles wrote:
> In article <3y6kd9f3mn1h$***@mid.crommatograph.info>, Quinn C
> <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:

>> The male/female by spelling thing seems to work well for the French,
>> where the rule is pretty clear - add an e to make a name female.
>
> diden't work with my daughter "Jo" - you add an e for the male version.

Nor for my ex-wife Marion.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW, Australia
Quinn C
2018-09-16 15:14:00 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Peter Moylan:

> On 16/09/18 18:19, charles wrote:
>> In article <3y6kd9f3mn1h$***@mid.crommatograph.info>, Quinn C
>> <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
>
>>> The male/female by spelling thing seems to work well for the French,
>>> where the rule is pretty clear - add an e to make a name female.
>>
>> diden't work with my daughter "Jo" - you add an e for the male version.

In French?

> Nor for my ex-wife Marion.

Sigh. People are immediately venturing outside the parameters.

I thought it was clear that I'm talking about names that

1. are used for men and women
2. sound the same whether used for men or women
3. have more than one spelling
4. and where the spelling is somewhat indicative of the intended gender

Marion, AFAIK, fails condition 3, and then of course 4 is n/a. Besides,
I've never heard of a French (or German) male Marion, so in this case
the nationality is strongly indicative of gender.

As for Jo(e), with all due respect, it's not traditionally a full name,
and for shortened or nicknames, the rules are usually relaxed. Even in
countries that insist that registered names are indicative of gender,
there are often unisex shortened or nicknames.

So I probably also want

0. traditionally used as a registered name.

--
The nice thing about standards is that you have so many to choose
from; furthermore, if you do not like any of them, you can just
wait for next year's model.
Andrew Tanenbaum, _Computer Networks_ (1981), p. 168.
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-09-16 15:33:53 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Sunday, 16 September 2018 16:13:40 UTC+1, Quinn C wrote:
> * Peter Moylan:
>
> > On 16/09/18 18:19, charles wrote:
> >> In article <3y6kd9f3mn1h$***@mid.crommatograph.info>, Quinn C
> >> <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
> >
> >>> The male/female by spelling thing seems to work well for the French,
> >>> where the rule is pretty clear - add an e to make a name female.
> >>
> >> diden't work with my daughter "Jo" - you add an e for the male version.
>
> In French?
>
> > Nor for my ex-wife Marion.
>
> Sigh. People are immediately venturing outside the parameters.
>
> I thought it was clear that I'm talking about names that
>
> 1. are used for men and women
> 2. sound the same whether used for men or women
> 3. have more than one spelling
> 4. and where the spelling is somewhat indicative of the intended gender

As you gave no examples I fail to see how this could have been made clear.
Besides which, the imposition of these conditions changes your original
statement that there was a method in French of rendering male names as
female names to a simple, and frankly trivial, statement that there are
some French names (although again we still have no examples) which have
a feminised form created by adding an e to the masculine. Well, yeah, but
so what? Several languages have Johan and Johanna. Does that mean that
we can say that adding 'na' is a problem free method of getting a girl's name
from a boy's?

>
> Marion, AFAIK, fails condition 3, and then of course 4 is n/a. Besides,
> I've never heard of a French (or German) male Marion, so in this case
> the nationality is strongly indicative of gender.
>
> As for Jo(e), with all due respect, it's not traditionally a full name,
> and for shortened or nicknames, the rules are usually relaxed. Even in
> countries that insist that registered names are indicative of gender,
> there are often unisex shortened or nicknames.
>
> So I probably also want
>
> 0. traditionally used as a registered name.
>
> --
> The nice thing about standards is that you have so many to choose
> from; furthermore, if you do not like any of them, you can just
> wait for next year's model.
> Andrew Tanenbaum, _Computer Networks_ (1981), p. 168.
Tak To
2018-09-15 04:25:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
> --
> The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
> whole thread about it.

The first famous Leslie that came into mind is Leslie
Howard, aka Ashley Wilkes, or Henry Higgins, or the
Scarlet Pimpernel, or the chump with the club foot
(/Of Human Bondage/), etc.

Seeing Leslie Nielsen in one of his earlier serious
roles is a disconcerting experience.

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ***@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr
Lewis
2018-09-15 11:27:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
In message <pni1je$pc1$***@dont-email.me> Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx> wrote:
> On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
>> --
>> The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
>> whole thread about it.

> The first famous Leslie that came into mind is Leslie
> Howard, aka Ashley Wilkes, or Henry Higgins, or the
> Scarlet Pimpernel, or the chump with the club foot
> (/Of Human Bondage/), etc.

> Seeing Leslie Nielsen in one of his earlier serious
> roles is a disconcerting experience.

Currently Leslie Moonves is probably the most famous Leslie, at least
in the US.


--
We all need help with our feelings. Otherwise, we bottle them up, and
before you know it powerful laxatives are involved.
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-09-15 11:35:59 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Saturday, 15 September 2018 12:27:42 UTC+1, Lewis wrote:
> In message <pni1je$pc1$***@dont-email.me> Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx> wrote:
> > On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
> >> --
> >> The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
> >> whole thread about it.
>
> > The first famous Leslie that came into mind is Leslie
> > Howard, aka Ashley Wilkes, or Henry Higgins, or the
> > Scarlet Pimpernel, or the chump with the club foot
> > (/Of Human Bondage/), etc.
>
> > Seeing Leslie Nielsen in one of his earlier serious
> > roles is a disconcerting experience.
>
> Currently Leslie Moonves is probably the most famous Leslie, at least
> in the US.
>

ObBr: who?
Peter T. Daniels
2018-09-15 12:38:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 7:36:02 AM UTC-4, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
> On Saturday, 15 September 2018 12:27:42 UTC+1, Lewis wrote:
> > In message <pni1je$pc1$***@dont-email.me> Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx> wrote:
> > > On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:

> > >> The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
> > >> whole thread about it.
> > > The first famous Leslie that came into mind is Leslie
> > > Howard, aka Ashley Wilkes, or Henry Higgins, or the
> > > Scarlet Pimpernel, or the chump with the club foot
> > > (/Of Human Bondage/), etc.

Not a bad resume before going off to get killed in the War. Romeo
(opposite Norma Shearer) was perhaps not such a high point.

> > > Seeing Leslie Nielsen in one of his earlier serious
> > > roles is a disconcerting experience.

He did a couple of *Columbo*s.

> > Currently Leslie Moonves is probably the most famous Leslie, at least
> > in the US.
>
> ObBr: who?

The latest victim of Ronan Farrow's crusade in the New Yorker against
alleged sexual harassers. Head of CBS. Without Les (no one calls him
Leslie, except apparently Screwie Lewie) Moonves, there would be no
BBT, no CSI, no NCIS, no Colbert.

Ronan Farrow is the son of Mia Farrow who alleges that he, too, was
abused as a child by her partner, Woody Allen.
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-09-15 12:55:17 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Saturday, 15 September 2018 13:38:21 UTC+1, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 7:36:02 AM UTC-4, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
> > On Saturday, 15 September 2018 12:27:42 UTC+1, Lewis wrote:
> > > In message <pni1je$pc1$***@dont-email.me> Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx> wrote:
> > > > On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
>
> > > >> The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
> > > >> whole thread about it.
> > > > The first famous Leslie that came into mind is Leslie
> > > > Howard, aka Ashley Wilkes, or Henry Higgins, or the
> > > > Scarlet Pimpernel, or the chump with the club foot
> > > > (/Of Human Bondage/), etc.
>
> Not a bad resume before going off to get killed in the War.

That makes it sound like he died in combat. He was, of course,
merely a passenger on a scheduled airline flight 'accidentally'
shot down by German fighters.
Peter T. Daniels
2018-09-15 19:42:52 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 8:55:20 AM UTC-4, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
> On Saturday, 15 September 2018 13:38:21 UTC+1, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> > On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 7:36:02 AM UTC-4, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
> > > On Saturday, 15 September 2018 12:27:42 UTC+1, Lewis wrote:
> > > > In message <pni1je$pc1$***@dont-email.me> Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx> wrote:
> > > > > On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:

> > > > >> The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
> > > > >> whole thread about it.
> > > > > The first famous Leslie that came into mind is Leslie
> > > > > Howard, aka Ashley Wilkes, or Henry Higgins, or the
> > > > > Scarlet Pimpernel, or the chump with the club foot
> > > > > (/Of Human Bondage/), etc.
> > Not a bad resume before going off to get killed in the War.
>
> That makes it sound like he died in combat. He was, of course,
> merely a passenger on a scheduled airline flight 'accidentally'
> shot down by German fighters.

I did not know that.
RHDraney
2018-09-15 13:01:30 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/15/2018 5:38 AM, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 7:36:02 AM UTC-4, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>> On Saturday, 15 September 2018 12:27:42 UTC+1, Lewis wrote:
>
>>> Currently Leslie Moonves is probably the most famous Leslie, at least
>>> in the US.
>>
>> ObBr: who?
>
> The latest victim of Ronan Farrow's crusade in the New Yorker against
> alleged sexual harassers. Head of CBS. Without Les (no one calls him
> Leslie, except apparently Screwie Lewie) Moonves, there would be no
> BBT, no CSI, no NCIS, no Colbert.

And no "The Talk", given that his wife Julie Chen probably wouldn't have
been made the moderator of it....r
Peter T. Daniels
2018-09-15 19:45:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 9:02:04 AM UTC-4, RHDraney wrote:
> On 9/15/2018 5:38 AM, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> > On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 7:36:02 AM UTC-4, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
> >> On Saturday, 15 September 2018 12:27:42 UTC+1, Lewis wrote:

> >>> Currently Leslie Moonves is probably the most famous Leslie, at least
> >>> in the US.
> >> ObBr: who?
> > The latest victim of Ronan Farrow's crusade in the New Yorker against
> > alleged sexual harassers. Head of CBS. Without Les (no one calls him
> > Leslie, except apparently Screwie Lewie) Moonves, there would be no
> > BBT, no CSI, no NCIS, no Colbert.
>
> And no "The Talk", given that his wife Julie Chen probably wouldn't have
> been made the moderator of it....r

Naah, *The Talk* was inevitable given the success of *The View* on "another
network." Was he responsible, though, for Ms. Chen moving from hard news
to women's talk and to hosting *Big Brother*? Did he encourage her to have
the cosmetic surgery to make her look "less Chinese"?
Quinn C
2018-09-16 00:48:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Peter T. Daniels:

> On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 7:36:02 AM UTC-4, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>> On Saturday, 15 September 2018 12:27:42 UTC+1, Lewis wrote:
>>> In message <pni1je$pc1$***@dont-email.me> Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx> wrote:
>>> > On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
>
>>> >> The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
>>> >> whole thread about it.
>>> > The first famous Leslie that came into mind is Leslie
>>> > Howard, aka Ashley Wilkes, or Henry Higgins, or the
>>> > Scarlet Pimpernel, or the chump with the club foot
>>> > (/Of Human Bondage/), etc.
>
> Not a bad resume before going off to get killed in the War. Romeo
> (opposite Norma Shearer) was perhaps not such a high point.
>
>>> > Seeing Leslie Nielsen in one of his earlier serious
>>> > roles is a disconcerting experience.
>
> He did a couple of *Columbo*s.
>
>>> Currently Leslie Moonves is probably the most famous Leslie, at least
>>> in the US.
>>
>> ObBr: who?
>
> The latest victim of Ronan Farrow's crusade in the New Yorker against
> alleged sexual harassers. Head of CBS. Without Les (no one calls him
> Leslie, except apparently Screwie Lewie)

And all the news programs that I've heard about his demise.

> Moonves, there would be no
> BBT, no CSI, no NCIS, no Colbert.

Nonsense. Everyone is replaceable. Another person in his place might
not have lead to the exact same lineup of shows being made, but quite
possibly some of them and other, equally good ones. Or slightly less
good ones, which would still be a small price to pay for some people
not getting harassed.

--
...an explanatory principle - like "gravity" or "instinct" -
really explains nothing. It’s a sort of conventional agreement
between scientists to stop trying to explain things at a
certain point. -- Gregory Bateson
Lewis
2018-09-16 01:21:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
In message <***@mid.crommatograph.info> Quinn C <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
> * Peter T. Daniels:

>> On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 7:36:02 AM UTC-4, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>>> On Saturday, 15 September 2018 12:27:42 UTC+1, Lewis wrote:
>>>> In message <pni1je$pc1$***@dont-email.me> Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx> wrote:
>>>> > On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
>>
>>>> >> The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
>>>> >> whole thread about it.
>>>> > The first famous Leslie that came into mind is Leslie
>>>> > Howard, aka Ashley Wilkes, or Henry Higgins, or the
>>>> > Scarlet Pimpernel, or the chump with the club foot
>>>> > (/Of Human Bondage/), etc.
>>
>> Not a bad resume before going off to get killed in the War. Romeo
>> (opposite Norma Shearer) was perhaps not such a high point.
>>
>>>> > Seeing Leslie Nielsen in one of his earlier serious
>>>> > roles is a disconcerting experience.
>>
>> He did a couple of *Columbo*s.
>>
>>>> Currently Leslie Moonves is probably the most famous Leslie, at least
>>>> in the US.
>>>
>>> ObBr: who?
>>
>> The latest victim of Ronan Farrow's crusade in the New Yorker against
>> alleged sexual harassers. Head of CBS. Without Les (no one calls him
>> Leslie, except apparently Screwie Lewie)

> And all the news programs that I've heard about his demise.

>> Moonves, there would be no
>> BBT, no CSI, no NCIS, no Colbert.

> Nonsense. Everyone is replaceable. Another person in his place might
> not have lead to the exact same lineup of shows being made, but quite
> possibly some of them and other, equally good ones. Or slightly less
> good ones, which would still be a small price to pay for some people
> not getting harassed.

It's an absurd statement, as he didn't make a single one of those
shows. He BOUGHT them.

Big Bang Theory was created by Bill Prady and Chuck Lorre and produced
by Warner Brothers.

CSI was create by Anthony E. Zuiker, though that one was produced by
CBS, at least.

Probably it was Moonves's decision to hire Colbert, but SOMEONE was
going to hire him.

And if CBS hadn't bought CSI or NCIS, there were other networks.


--
Vampires have risen from the dead, the grave and the crypt, but have
never managed it from the cat. --Witches Abroad
Peter T. Daniels
2018-09-16 03:29:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 9:21:52 PM UTC-4, Lewis wrote:
> In message <***@mid.crommatograph.info> Quinn C <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
> > * Peter T. Daniels:
> >> On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 7:36:02 AM UTC-4, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
> >>> On Saturday, 15 September 2018 12:27:42 UTC+1, Lewis wrote:

> >>>> Currently Leslie Moonves is probably the most famous Leslie, at least
> >>>> in the US.
> >>> ObBr: who?
> >> The latest victim of Ronan Farrow's crusade in the New Yorker against
> >> alleged sexual harassers. Head of CBS. Without Les (no one calls him
> >> Leslie, except apparently Screwie Lewie)
> > And all the news programs that I've heard about his demise.
> >> Moonves, there would be no
> >> BBT, no CSI, no NCIS, no Colbert.
> > Nonsense. Everyone is replaceable. Another person in his place might
> > not have lead to the exact same lineup of shows being made, but quite
> > possibly some of them and other, equally good ones. Or slightly less
> > good ones, which would still be a small price to pay for some people
> > not getting harassed.
>
> It's an absurd statement, as he didn't make a single one of those
> shows. He BOUGHT them.
>
> Big Bang Theory was created by Bill Prady and Chuck Lorre and produced
> by Warner Brothers.
>
> CSI was create by Anthony E. Zuiker, though that one was produced by
> CBS, at least.
>
> Probably it was Moonves's decision to hire Colbert, but SOMEONE was
> going to hire him.
>
> And if CBS hadn't bought CSI or NCIS, there were other networks.

Screwie Lewie doesn't understand how pilots get made, either. They are not
done on spec. WB no longer has a TV network.
Peter T. Daniels
2018-09-16 03:27:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 8:48:39 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
> * Peter T. Daniels:
> > On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 7:36:02 AM UTC-4, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
> >> On Saturday, 15 September 2018 12:27:42 UTC+1, Lewis wrote:
> >>> In message <pni1je$pc1$***@dont-email.me> Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx> wrote:
> >>> > On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:

> >>> >> The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
> >>> >> whole thread about it.
> >>> > The first famous Leslie that came into mind is Leslie
> >>> > Howard, aka Ashley Wilkes, or Henry Higgins, or the
> >>> > Scarlet Pimpernel, or the chump with the club foot
> >>> > (/Of Human Bondage/), etc.
> > Not a bad resume before going off to get killed in the War. Romeo
> > (opposite Norma Shearer) was perhaps not such a high point.
> >>> > Seeing Leslie Nielsen in one of his earlier serious
> >>> > roles is a disconcerting experience.
> > He did a couple of *Columbo*s.
> >>> Currently Leslie Moonves is probably the most famous Leslie, at least
> >>> in the US.
> >> ObBr: who?
> > The latest victim of Ronan Farrow's crusade in the New Yorker against
> > alleged sexual harassers. Head of CBS. Without Les (no one calls him
> > Leslie, except apparently Screwie Lewie)
>
> And all the news programs that I've heard about his demise.

That's those polite Canadians. Note how Brader distorts people's names,
including yours.

> > Moonves, there would be no
> > BBT, no CSI, no NCIS, no Colbert.
>
> Nonsense. Everyone is replaceable. Another person in his place might
> not have lead to the exact same lineup of shows being made, but quite
> possibly some of them and other, equally good ones. Or slightly less
> good ones, which would still be a small price to pay for some people
> not getting harassed.

The process of making a TV pilot is more complicated than you seem to
realize.
RHDraney
2018-09-16 04:17:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/15/2018 8:27 PM, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> On Saturday, September 15, 2018 at 8:48:39 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
>> * Peter T. Daniels:

>>> The latest victim of Ronan Farrow's crusade in the New Yorker against
>>> alleged sexual harassers. Head of CBS. Without Les (no one calls him
>>> Leslie, except apparently Screwie Lewie)
>>
>> And all the news programs that I've heard about his demise.
>
> That's those polite Canadians. Note how Brader distorts people's names,
> including yours.

Note how Ronan Farrow now disavows his own given name Satchel....r
Quinn C
2018-09-15 13:14:09 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Lewis:

> In message <pni1je$pc1$***@dont-email.me> Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx> wrote:
>> On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
>>> --
>>> The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
>>> whole thread about it.
>
>> The first famous Leslie that came into mind is Leslie
>> Howard, aka Ashley Wilkes, or Henry Higgins, or the
>> Scarlet Pimpernel, or the chump with the club foot
>> (/Of Human Bondage/), etc.
>
>> Seeing Leslie Nielsen in one of his earlier serious
>> roles is a disconcerting experience.
>
> Currently Leslie Moonves is probably the most famous Leslie, at least
> in the US.

For 15 minutes, sure.
--
ASCII to ASCII, DOS to DOS
Lewis
2018-09-15 20:25:03 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
In message <***@mid.crommatograph.info> Quinn C <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
> * Lewis:

>> In message <pni1je$pc1$***@dont-email.me> Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx> wrote:
>>> On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
>>>> --
>>>> The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
>>>> whole thread about it.
>>
>>> The first famous Leslie that came into mind is Leslie
>>> Howard, aka Ashley Wilkes, or Henry Higgins, or the
>>> Scarlet Pimpernel, or the chump with the club foot
>>> (/Of Human Bondage/), etc.
>>
>>> Seeing Leslie Nielsen in one of his earlier serious
>>> roles is a disconcerting experience.
>>
>> Currently Leslie Moonves is probably the most famous Leslie, at least
>> in the US.

> For 15 minutes, sure.

Thus "currently".

--
So now you know the words to our song, pretty soon you'll all be singing
along, when you're sad, when you're lonely and it all turns out wrong...
Tak To
2018-09-15 21:24:12 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/15/2018 7:27 AM, Lewis wrote:
> In message <pni1je$pc1$***@dont-email.me> Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx> wrote:
>> On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
>>> --
>>> The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
>>> whole thread about it.
>
>> The first famous Leslie that came into mind is Leslie
>> Howard, aka Ashley Wilkes, or Henry Higgins, or the
>> Scarlet Pimpernel, or the chump with the club foot
>> (/Of Human Bondage/), etc.
>
>> Seeing Leslie Nielsen in one of his earlier serious
>> roles is a disconcerting experience.
>
> Currently Leslie Moonves is probably the most famous Leslie, at least
> in the US.

He is generally known as Les; whereas Lt General Leslie
Richard Groves Jr, overseer of the Manhattan Project,
was generally known as Dick.

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ***@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr
Quinn C
2018-09-15 13:11:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Tak To:

> On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
>> --
>> The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
>> whole thread about it.
>
> The first famous Leslie that came into mind is Leslie
> Howard, aka Ashley Wilkes, or Henry Higgins, or the
> Scarlet Pimpernel, or the chump with the club foot
> (/Of Human Bondage/), etc.

Hm. A British actor long dead before I was born.

I was made to see Gone With the Wind in school; that was so torturous
that I never felt like trying again, so I didn't remember the name
"Ashley Wilkes" either. I don't think I saw any of his "many other
notable films" (Wikipedia). No, I'm not proud of that, but I also don't
believe the crowd who won't watch subtitled material enjoys the ol'
black-and-whiteys, so I'd suppose he's bigger in the history of movies
books than in popular consciousness.

--
Spell checker (n.) One who gives examinations on witchcraft.
Herman Rubin in sci.lang

Disclaimer: I, Quinn, don't think this is the usual meaning of
"spell checker"
Tak To
2018-09-15 21:49:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/15/2018 9:11 AM, Quinn C wrote:
> * Tak To:
>
>> On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, Quinn C wrote:
>>> --
>>> The most famous Leslie is arguably Leslie Nielsen. Please don't make a
>>> whole thread about it.
>>
>> The first famous Leslie that came into mind is Leslie
>> Howard, aka Ashley Wilkes, or Henry Higgins, or the
>> Scarlet Pimpernel, or the chump with the club foot
>> (/Of Human Bondage/), etc.
>
> Hm. A British actor long dead before I was born.
>
> I was made to see Gone With the Wind in school; that was so torturous
> that I never felt like trying again, so I didn't remember the name
> "Ashley Wilkes" either. I don't think I saw any of his "many other
> notable films" (Wikipedia). No, I'm not proud of that, but I also don't
> believe the crowd who won't watch subtitled material enjoys the ol'
> black-and-whiteys, so I'd suppose he's bigger in the history of movies
> books than in popular consciousness.

I don't disagree; I wasn't arguing about who's more famous.

I was just enjoying a bit of private snobbery fun like some
other members of AUE. Note that it was not nostalgia either
-- Leslie Howard was way before my time too.

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ***@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr
Anders D. Nygaard
2018-09-17 21:23:47 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Den 13-09-2018 kl. 18:42 skrev Madrigal Gurneyhalt:
> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 17:14:31 UTC+1, Tony Cooper wrote:
>> On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 11:32:15 -0400, Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 9/13/2018 9:47 AM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>>>> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 14:15:54 UTC+1, Quinn C wrote:
>>>>> * ***@aol.com:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>>>>>> On 13/09/18 07:58, Peter Duncanson [BrE] wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Wed, 12 Sep 2018 14:20:19 -0400, Quinn C
>>>>>>>> <***@crommatograph.info> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> This headline greeted me this morning:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Jailed Lula Pulls Out of Brazil Election
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I spent about 5 seconds considering how the first name "Jailed"
>>>>>>>>> would be pronounced in Brazilian Portuguese.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> <smile>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
>>>>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
>>>>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
>>>>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
>>>>>> as JAY-mee.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
>>>>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
>>>>>> is indeed pronounced as [?xai me].
>>>>>
>>>>> Obviously, people do get confused between Jamie and Jaime.
>>>>
>>>> No they get confused by Jaime and Jaime being pronounced,
>>>> correctly, in several different ways. The most famous Jaimes
>>>> (actresses King and Murray, for example) pronounce it Jay-me
>>>> so it's no surprise that people assume that's always how it's
>>>> said.
>>>
>>> The most famous Jaime is arguably Jaime Lannister
>>> (pronounced Jay-me).
>>
>> Whenever someone refers to someone being famous, and I have absolutely
>> no idea of who the supposed famous person is or was, I look up that
>> name.
>>
>> I did, and I am in agreement with the word "arguably" in the
>> statement. Very arguable.
>
> People who watch Game of Thrones assume that everybody on the planet
> does too. As delusions go it's fairly harmless. Can't say that I've ever
> seen a minute of it. I know some of the actors from other work (Peter
> Dinklage, Emilia Clarke, Maisie Williams) but not Nikolaj!

Nikolaj first became known as the lead in "Nattevagten"
which was later remade in English as "Nightwatch".
He also played a part in "Black Hawk Down".

/Anders, Denmark.
Quinn C
2018-09-13 17:18:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Tony Cooper:

> On Thu, 13 Sep 2018 11:32:15 -0400, Tak To <***@alum.mit.eduxx>
> wrote:
>
>>On 9/13/2018 9:47 AM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>>> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 14:15:54 UTC+1, Quinn C wrote:
>>>> * ***@aol.com:
>>>>
>>>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>>>>
>>>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
>>>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
>>>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>>>>>
>>>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
>>>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
>>>>> as JAY-mee.
>>>>>
>>>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
>>>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
>>>>> is indeed pronounced as [?xai me].
>>>>
>>>> Obviously, people do get confused between Jamie and Jaime.
>>>
>>> No they get confused by Jaime and Jaime being pronounced,
>>> correctly, in several different ways. The most famous Jaimes
>>> (actresses King and Murray, for example) pronounce it Jay-me
>>> so it's no surprise that people assume that's always how it's
>>> said.
>>
>>The most famous Jaime is arguably Jaime Lannister
>>(pronounced Jay-me).
>
> Whenever someone refers to someone being famous, and I have absolutely
> no idea of who the supposed famous person is or was, I look up that
> name.
>
> I did, and I am in agreement with the word "arguably" in the
> statement. Very arguable.

Agreed. I know and adore Jaime Murray, but wouldn't have been sure
about the spelling of her first name.

When I tried to pull a "famous Jaime" out of my head, I came up with
Jaime Laredo, but he's not even in the list of famous Jaimes at
Wikipedia (gotta change that.)

> I do assume that "Jamie" is pronounced "Jay-me", but I don't have any
> idea how to pronounce "Nikolaj" (the actor who plays Jamie). He's
> Danish, so my brother might know. His wife's first name is Nukâka,
> and she's from Greenland.
>
> I would not like to be the person that has to introduce this couple.

I think it's a safe bet that in "Nikolaj", each letter but the last has
it's most usual pronunciation. But that's hard on English speakers, who
are used to using letters in various unusual ways.

The j is the only letter that raises any question in my mind, but in
the combination aj at the end, I'd go with /j/. I.e., I'm pretty sure
/nikolaj/ or /nIkolaj/ is at least pretty close. Surprise?

--
Bug:
An elusive creature living in a program that makes it incorrect.
The activity of "debugging," or removing bugs from a program, ends
when people get tired of doing it, not when the bugs are removed.

Disclaimer: I, Quinn, don't believe this fairly describes all
debugging.
Tak To
2018-09-13 18:29:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/13/2018 1:18 PM, Quinn C wrote:
> [...]
>
> When I tried to pull a "famous Jaime" out of my head, I came up with
> Jaime Laredo, but he's not even in the list of famous Jaimes at
> Wikipedia (gotta change that.)

I would like to see Jamie Hyneman on the list.

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ***@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr
Anders D. Nygaard
2018-09-17 21:17:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Den 13-09-2018 kl. 19:18 skrev Quinn C:
> * Tony Cooper:
> [...] I don't have any
>> idea how to pronounce "Nikolaj" (the actor who plays Jamie). He's
>> Danish, so my brother might know. His wife's first name is Nukâka,
>> and she's from Greenland.
>>
>> I would not like to be the person that has to introduce this couple.
>
> I think it's a safe bet that in "Nikolaj", each letter but the last has
> it's most usual pronunciation. But that's hard on English speakers, who
> are used to using letters in various unusual ways.
>
> The j is the only letter that raises any question in my mind, but in
> the combination aj at the end, I'd go with /j/. I.e., I'm pretty sure
> /nikolaj/ or /nIkolaj/ is at least pretty close.

Yep. And the first vowel should be the same as in "fish", so it is
different from the Nicolai referenced in
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXlfXirQF3A

> Surprise?

Not to me.

/Anders, Denmark.
Quinn C
2018-09-13 17:18:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
> On 9/13/2018 9:47 AM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 14:15:54 UTC+1, Quinn C wrote:
>>> * ***@aol.com:
>>>
>>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>>>
>>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
>>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
>>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>>>>
>>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
>>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
>>>> as JAY-mee.
>>>>
>>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
>>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
>>>> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
>>>
>>> Obviously, people do get confused between Jamie and Jaime.
>>
>> No they get confused by Jaime and Jaime being pronounced,
>> correctly, in several different ways.

Sure, that's why the Wikipedia page on Jaime Murray says "Not to be
confused with Jamie Murray."

--
There are two ways of constructing a software design. One way is
to make it so simple that there are obviously no deficiencies.
And the other way is to make it so complicated that there are no
obvious deficiencies. The first method is far more difficult.
-- C. A. R. Hoare
RHDraney
2018-09-13 19:48:54 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/13/2018 8:32 AM, Tak To wrote:
> On 9/13/2018 9:47 AM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
>> On Thursday, 13 September 2018 14:15:54 UTC+1, Quinn C wrote:
>>>
>>> Obviously, people do get confused between Jamie and Jaime.
>>
>> No they get confused by Jaime and Jaime being pronounced,
>> correctly, in several different ways. The most famous Jaimes
>> (actresses King and Murray, for example) pronounce it Jay-me
>> so it's no surprise that people assume that's always how it's
>> said.
>
> The most famous Jaime is arguably Jaime Lannister
> (pronounced Jay-me).

"Arguably" doesn't begin to cover it...this is one of those "famous"
people I've never heard of (the alt.obituaries group is full of them)....

As far as I'm concerned, the most famous Jaime with that pronunciation
was Jaime Sommers, the Bionic Woman....r
Peter T. Daniels
2018-09-13 14:50:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 8:53:55 AM UTC-4, ***@aol.com wrote:
> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :

> > A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
> > met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
> > Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>
> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
> as JAY-mee.
>
> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].

The character played by Helen Hunt in the sitcom *Mad About You* (that was
before she became a movie star) was named "James" and called "Jamie." The
mom on *The Waltons* was played by Miss Michael Learned (that's how she
was billed).
Quinn C
2018-09-13 17:48:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Peter T. Daniels:

> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 8:53:55 AM UTC-4, ***@aol.com wrote:
>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>
>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>>
>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
>> as JAY-mee.
>>
>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
>> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
>
> The character played by Helen Hunt in the sitcom *Mad About You* (that was
> before she became a movie star) was named "James" and called "Jamie." The
> mom on *The Waltons* was played by Miss Michael Learned (that's how she
> was billed).

Seems to be her name since birth. But what's the connetion to "Jaime"?

--
Some things are taken away from you, some you leave behind-and
some you carry with you, world without end.
-- Robert C. Wilson, Vortex (novel), p.31
Quinn C
2018-09-13 17:54:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Quinn C:

> * Peter T. Daniels:
>
>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 8:53:55 AM UTC-4, ***@aol.com wrote:
>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>
>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>>>
>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
>>> as JAY-mee.
>>>
>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
>>> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
>>
>> The character played by Helen Hunt in the sitcom *Mad About You* (that was
>> before she became a movie star) was named "James" and called "Jamie."

Actually, it seems that you got this one the wrong way round. She's
Jamie "James" Buchman.

--
Trans people are scapegoated for the impossibilities of this two-box
system, but the system harms all of us. Most people have felt ashamed
of the ways we don't conform to whatever narrow idea of man or woman
has been prescribed onto our bodies -- H.P.Keenan in Slate
Peter T. Daniels
2018-09-13 20:29:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 1:48:19 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
> * Peter T. Daniels:
>
> > On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 8:53:55 AM UTC-4, ***@aol.com wrote:
> >> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
> >
> >>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
> >>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
> >>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
> >>
> >> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
> >> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
> >> as JAY-mee.
> >>
> >> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
> >> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
> >> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
> >
> > The character played by Helen Hunt in the sitcom *Mad About You* (that was
> > before she became a movie star) was named "James" and called "Jamie." The
> > mom on *The Waltons* was played by Miss Michael Learned (that's how she
> > was billed).
>
> Seems to be her name since birth. But what's the connetion to "Jaime"?

Women with male names, of course.

Cf. also Jaime Pressly, currently in *Mom*, previously in *My Name is Earl*.
Quinn C
2018-09-13 22:03:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Peter T. Daniels:

> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 1:48:19 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
>> * Peter T. Daniels:
>>
>>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 8:53:55 AM UTC-4, ***@aol.com wrote:
>>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>>
>>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
>>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
>>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>>>>
>>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
>>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
>>>> as JAY-mee.
>>>>
>>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
>>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
>>>> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
>>>
>>> The character played by Helen Hunt in the sitcom *Mad About You* (that was
>>> before she became a movie star) was named "James" and called "Jamie." The
>>> mom on *The Waltons* was played by Miss Michael Learned (that's how she
>>> was billed).
>>
>> Seems to be her name since birth. But what's the connetion to "Jaime"?
>
> Women with male names, of course.

But "Jaymee" was introduced as unisex in this thread. You disagree?

--
Failover worked - the system failed, then it was over.
(freely translated from a remark by Dietz Proepper
in de.alt.sysadmin.recovery)

Disclaimer: I, Quinn, don't believe "failover" is ever
intended to mean that
Peter T. Daniels
2018-09-14 02:37:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 6:03:34 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
> * Peter T. Daniels:
>
> > On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 1:48:19 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
> >> * Peter T. Daniels:
> >>
> >>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 8:53:55 AM UTC-4, ***@aol.com wrote:
> >>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
> >>>
> >>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
> >>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
> >>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
> >>>>
> >>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
> >>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
> >>>> as JAY-mee.
> >>>>
> >>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
> >>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
> >>>> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
> >>>
> >>> The character played by Helen Hunt in the sitcom *Mad About You* (that was
> >>> before she became a movie star) was named "James" and called "Jamie." The
> >>> mom on *The Waltons* was played by Miss Michael Learned (that's how she
> >>> was billed).
> >>
> >> Seems to be her name since birth. But what's the connetion to "Jaime"?
> >
> > Women with male names, of course.
>
> But "Jaymee" was introduced as unisex in this thread. You disagree?

Does "James" look like "Jaymee" to you?
Quinn C
2018-09-14 03:07:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Peter T. Daniels:

> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 6:03:34 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
>> * Peter T. Daniels:
>>
>>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 1:48:19 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
>>>> * Peter T. Daniels:
>>>>
>>>>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 8:53:55 AM UTC-4, ***@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>>>>
>>>>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
>>>>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
>>>>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
>>>>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
>>>>>> as JAY-mee.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
>>>>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
>>>>>> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
>>>>>
>>>>> The character played by Helen Hunt in the sitcom *Mad About You* (that was
>>>>> before she became a movie star) was named "James" and called "Jamie." The
>>>>> mom on *The Waltons* was played by Miss Michael Learned (that's how she
>>>>> was billed).
>>>>
>>>> Seems to be her name since birth. But what's the connetion to "Jaime"?
>>>
>>> Women with male names, of course.
>>
>> But "Jaymee" was introduced as unisex in this thread. You disagree?
>
> Does "James" look like "Jaymee" to you?

What's the connection to "Jaime"?

Let me answer that for you: "Jaime" looks a lot like "Jamie", and
"Jamie" *could* be short for "James". That's free association rather
than a topical connection.

--
The trouble some people have being German, I thought,
I have being human.
-- Margaret Atwood, Surfacing (novel), p.130
Tak To
2018-09-14 14:25:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/13/2018 11:07 PM, Quinn C wrote:
> * Peter T. Daniels:
>
>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 6:03:34 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
>>> * Peter T. Daniels:
>>>
>>>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 1:48:19 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
>>>>> * Peter T. Daniels:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 8:53:55 AM UTC-4, ***@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
>>>>>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
>>>>>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
>>>>>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
>>>>>>> as JAY-mee.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
>>>>>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
>>>>>>> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The character played by Helen Hunt in the sitcom *Mad About You* (that was
>>>>>> before she became a movie star) was named "James" and called "Jamie." The
>>>>>> mom on *The Waltons* was played by Miss Michael Learned (that's how she
>>>>>> was billed).
>>>>>
>>>>> Seems to be her name since birth. But what's the connetion to "Jaime"?
>>>>
>>>> Women with male names, of course.
>>>
>>> But "Jaymee" was introduced as unisex in this thread. You disagree?
>>
>> Does "James" look like "Jaymee" to you?
>
> What's the connection to "Jaime"?
>
> Let me answer that for you: "Jaime" looks a lot like "Jamie", and
> "Jamie" *could* be short for "James". That's free association rather
> than a topical connection.

Random notes:

- I don't know any Jamie personally, and the couple of
Jaimes I know are Jews. (One has his birthday on 2/29.)

- Now that Jesse Jackson has earned the status of an elderly
statesman, people forget that he once called NYC "Hymie
Town".

- Quite coincidentally, there is the transwoman actor
Jaime Clayton and the transman muscian Jaime Wilson.
(The latter has a duet with his former self.)

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ***@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2018-09-14 08:43:35 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 2018-09-14 02:37:39 +0000, Peter T. Daniels said:

> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 6:03:34 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
>> * Peter T. Daniels:
>>
>>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 1:48:19 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
>>>> * Peter T. Daniels:
>>>>
>>>>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 8:53:55 AM UTC-4, ***@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>>>>
>>>>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
>>>>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
>>>>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
>>>>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
>>>>>> as JAY-mee.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
>>>>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
>>>>>> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
>>>>>
>>>>> The character played by Helen Hunt in the sitcom *Mad About You* (that
>>>>> was> >>> before she became a movie star) was named "James" and called
>>>>> "Jamie." The> >>> mom on *The Waltons* was played by Miss Michael
>>>>> Learned (that's how she> >>> was billed).
>>>>
>>>> Seems to be her name since birth. But what's the connetion to "Jaime"?
>>>
>>> Women with male names, of course.
>>
>> But "Jaymee" was introduced as unisex in this thread. You disagree?
>
> Does "James" look like "Jaymee" to you?

Just about anything looks non-binary to some.


--
athel
Peter T. Daniels
2018-09-14 12:23:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 4:43:37 AM UTC-4, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> On 2018-09-14 02:37:39 +0000, Peter T. Daniels said:
> > On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 6:03:34 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
> >> * Peter T. Daniels:
> >>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 1:48:19 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
> >>>> * Peter T. Daniels:
> >>>>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 8:53:55 AM UTC-4, ***@aol.com wrote:
> >>>>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :

> >>>>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
> >>>>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
> >>>>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
> >>>>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
> >>>>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
> >>>>>> as JAY-mee.
> >>>>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
> >>>>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
> >>>>>> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The character played by Helen Hunt in the sitcom *Mad About You* (that
> >>>>> was> >>> before she became a movie star) was named "James" and called
> >>>>> "Jamie." The> >>> mom on *The Waltons* was played by Miss Michael
> >>>>> Learned (that's how she> >>> was billed).
> >>>> Seems to be her name since birth. But what's the connetion to "Jaime"?
> >>> Women with male names, of course.
> >> But "Jaymee" was introduced as unisex in this thread. You disagree?
> > Does "James" look like "Jaymee" to you?
>
> Just about anything looks non-binary to some.

But I wasn't talking about "Jaymee," I was talking about "James."

Presumably the character's backstory was that she was from a traditional
Southern family where girls often had a maternal family name as their
given name. (Cf. Harper Lee.) (Sometimes boys, too -- Gore Vidal was a
not-too-distant cousin of Al Gore.)
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-09-14 12:47:15 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Friday, 14 September 2018 13:23:04 UTC+1, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 4:43:37 AM UTC-4, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> > On 2018-09-14 02:37:39 +0000, Peter T. Daniels said:
> > > On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 6:03:34 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
> > >> * Peter T. Daniels:
> > >>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 1:48:19 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
> > >>>> * Peter T. Daniels:
> > >>>>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 8:53:55 AM UTC-4, ***@aol.com wrote:
> > >>>>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>
> > >>>>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
> > >>>>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
> > >>>>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
> > >>>>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
> > >>>>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
> > >>>>>> as JAY-mee.
> > >>>>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
> > >>>>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
> > >>>>>> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> The character played by Helen Hunt in the sitcom *Mad About You* (that
> > >>>>> was> >>> before she became a movie star) was named "James" and called
> > >>>>> "Jamie." The> >>> mom on *The Waltons* was played by Miss Michael
> > >>>>> Learned (that's how she> >>> was billed).
> > >>>> Seems to be her name since birth. But what's the connetion to "Jaime"?
> > >>> Women with male names, of course.
> > >> But "Jaymee" was introduced as unisex in this thread. You disagree?
> > > Does "James" look like "Jaymee" to you?
> >
> > Just about anything looks non-binary to some.
>
> But I wasn't talking about "Jaymee," I was talking about "James."
>
> Presumably the character's backstory was that she was from a traditional
> Southern family where girls often had a maternal family name as their
> given name. (Cf. Harper Lee.) (Sometimes boys, too -- Gore Vidal was a
> not-too-distant cousin of Al Gore.)

If we're still talking about Mad About You, no, on all counts. To start with
James is a nickname not a given name. Her given name is Jamie. And
there's no hint of a Southern background. Her father was played by
Bronxman Carrol O'Connor (who by coincidence died in Helen Hunt's
birthplace).
Tak To
2018-09-14 14:35:33 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/14/2018 8:47 AM, Madrigal Gurneyhalt wrote:
> [...]
>
> If we're still talking about Mad About You, no, on all counts. To start with
> James is a nickname not a given name. Her given name is Jamie. And
> there's no hint of a Southern background. Her father was played by
> Bronxman Carrol O'Connor (who by coincidence died in Helen Hunt's
> birthplace).

Carroll

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ***@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr
Quinn C
2018-09-14 12:52:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
* Peter T. Daniels:

> On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 4:43:37 AM UTC-4, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>> On 2018-09-14 02:37:39 +0000, Peter T. Daniels said:
>>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 6:03:34 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
>>>> * Peter T. Daniels:
>>>>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 1:48:19 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
>>>>>> * Peter T. Daniels:
>>>>>>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 8:53:55 AM UTC-4, ***@aol.com wrote:
>>>>>>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>
>>>>>>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
>>>>>>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
>>>>>>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
>>>>>>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
>>>>>>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
>>>>>>>> as JAY-mee.
>>>>>>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
>>>>>>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
>>>>>>>> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The character played by Helen Hunt in the sitcom *Mad About You* (that
>>>>>>> was> >>> before she became a movie star) was named "James" and called
>>>>>>> "Jamie." The> >>> mom on *The Waltons* was played by Miss Michael
>>>>>>> Learned (that's how she> >>> was billed).
>>>>>> Seems to be her name since birth. But what's the connetion to "Jaime"?
>>>>> Women with male names, of course.
>>>> But "Jaymee" was introduced as unisex in this thread. You disagree?
>>> Does "James" look like "Jaymee" to you?
>>
>> Just about anything looks non-binary to some.
>
> But I wasn't talking about "Jaymee," I was talking about "James."
>
> Presumably the character's backstory was that she was from a traditional
> Southern family where girls often had a maternal family name as their
> given name. (Cf. Harper Lee.)

Ah, I was wondering about that one.

I've not seen Mad About You, but all online references indicate that
she was named Jamie, and called James. It's so convenient to ignore
information that isn't in the quotes.

It would make sense if she was named "Jamie" to honor the maternal
family name "James", and then friends would pick up on that. I had a
girlfriend with the baptismal name "Johanna", after John the Baptist,
not after any of the various saints Johanna (Joan.)

> (Sometimes boys, too -- Gore Vidal was a
> not-too-distant cousin of Al Gore.)

Using family names as boys' names is an older and far more widespread
tradition.

--
The nice thing about standards is that you have so many to choose
from; furthermore, if you do not like any of them, you can just
wait for next year's model.
Andrew Tanenbaum, _Computer Networks_ (1981), p. 168.
Peter T. Daniels
2018-09-14 18:23:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 8:52:34 AM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
> * Peter T. Daniels:
> > On Friday, September 14, 2018 at 4:43:37 AM UTC-4, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> >> On 2018-09-14 02:37:39 +0000, Peter T. Daniels said:
> >>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 6:03:34 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
> >>>> * Peter T. Daniels:
> >>>>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 1:48:19 PM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
> >>>>>> * Peter T. Daniels:
> >>>>>>> On Thursday, September 13, 2018 at 8:53:55 AM UTC-4, ***@aol.com wrote:
> >>>>>>>> Le jeudi 13 septembre 2018 09:44:44 UTC+2, Peter Moylan a écrit :

> >>>>>>>>> A political candidate in this region has first name Jaimie. Not having
> >>>>>>>>> met this name before, I almost automatically pronounced it Hymie.
> >>>>>>>>> Incorrectly, as it turned out.
> >>>>>>>> Apparently, the English unisex given name "Jaimie" has the variations
> >>>>>>>> of "Jaime", "Jami", Jamie, Jayme and Jaymi, which are all pronounced
> >>>>>>>> as JAY-mee.
> >>>>>>>> The pronunciation of (or close to) "Hymie" can only match the spelling
> >>>>>>>> "Jaime", and in that case, it's a Spanish masculine given name, which
> >>>>>>>> is indeed pronounced as [ˈxai me].
> >>>>>>> The character played by Helen Hunt in the sitcom *Mad About You* (that
> >>>>>>> was> >>> before she became a movie star) was named "James" and called
> >>>>>>> "Jamie." The> >>> mom on *The Waltons* was played by Miss Michael
> >>>>>>> Learned (that's how she> >>> was billed).
> >>>>>> Seems to be her name since birth. But what's the connetion to "Jaime"?
> >>>>> Women with male names, of course.
> >>>> But "Jaymee" was introduced as unisex in this thread. You disagree?
> >>> Does "James" look like "Jaymee" to you?
> >> Just about anything looks non-binary to some.
> > But I wasn't talking about "Jaymee," I was talking about "James."
> > Presumably the character's backstory was that she was from a traditional
> > Southern family where girls often had a maternal family name as their
> > given name. (Cf. Harper Lee.)
>
> Ah, I was wondering about that one.
>
> I've not seen Mad About You, but all online references indicate that
> she was named Jamie, and called James. It's so convenient to ignore
> information that isn't in the quotes.

BE that as it may, was it ever established on the show itself?

It aired long before that sort of information was available to the gen.pub.

It was something I was always curious about. Similarly, it was never
explained why Andy Sipowicz on *NYPD Blue* had a heavy Chicago accent.

(Some long-running series -- it might even have been BBT -- put titles on
the episodes that no one would see, because they never appeared anywhere
but on the scripts. Then The Internets started publicizing such things,
and referring to episodes by name became a thing, so they had to keep
coming up with inventive names.)

> It would make sense if she was named "Jamie" to honor the maternal
> family name "James", and then friends would pick up on that. I had a

Do you have evidence of such distortions of family names being a thing?

> girlfriend with the baptismal name "Johanna", after John the Baptist,
> not after any of the various saints Johanna (Joan.)

Hardly relevant.

> > (Sometimes boys, too -- Gore Vidal was a
> > not-too-distant cousin of Al Gore.)
>
> Using family names as boys' names is an older and far more widespread
> tradition.
Janet
2018-09-15 15:43:15 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
In article <bd33f907-afff-47da-b601-***@googlegroups.com>,
***@verizon.net says...

quinn wrote

> > It would make sense if she was named "Jamie" to honor the maternal
> > family name "James", and then friends would pick up on that. I had a
>
> Do you have evidence of such distortions of family names being a thing?

Naming daughters with a feminised version of either a male relative's
forename, or a family surname, was once fashionable in Scotland.

I've met a Donaldina,Jamesina and the unfortunate Archibelle, whose
mother's family name was Archibald.



Janet.
Cheryl
2018-09-15 16:10:30 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 2018-09-15 1:13 PM, Janet wrote:
> In article <bd33f907-afff-47da-b601-***@googlegroups.com>,
> ***@verizon.net says...
>
> quinn wrote
>
>>> It would make sense if she was named "Jamie" to honor the maternal
>>> family name "James", and then friends would pick up on that. I had a
>>
>> Do you have evidence of such distortions of family names being a thing?
>
> Naming daughters with a feminised version of either a male relative's
> forename, or a family surname, was once fashionable in Scotland.
>
> I've met a Donaldina,Jamesina and the unfortunate Archibelle, whose
> mother's family name was Archibald.

Allegedly, one of those radio shows that used to broadcasts personal
messages had one for Chestina, whose father was probably Chesley.

I was nearly named Edwina for my father Edward, but he disliked the name.

In any families I've come across personally, if someone wanted to honour
a branch of the family in the name of a female child, they just put the
surname in there, usually as a middle name. My mother wanted to do that,
too, but since her family name began with "A", it was too hard to find a
combination she liked that didn't become a word when written as initials.


--
Cheryl
RHDraney
2018-09-15 20:51:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
On 9/15/2018 8:43 AM, Janet wrote:
> In article <bd33f907-afff-47da-b601-***@googlegroups.com>,
> ***@verizon.net says...
>
> quinn wrote
>
>>> It would make sense if she was named "Jamie" to honor the maternal
>>> family name "James", and then friends would pick up on that. I had a
>>
>> Do you have evidence of such distortions of family names being a thing?
>
> Naming daughters with a feminised version of either a male relative's
> forename, or a family surname, was once fashionable in Scotland.
>
> I've met a Donaldina,Jamesina and the unfortunate Archibelle, whose
> mother's family name was Archibald.

My mother's name was Theadora...she was named for her grandfather
Theadore....r
Lewis
2018-09-16 01:26:46 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
In message <***@news1.newsguy.com> RHDraney <***@cox.net> wrote:
> On 9/15/2018 8:43 AM, Janet wrote:
>> In article <bd33f907-afff-47da-b601-***@googlegroups.com>,
>> ***@verizon.net says...
>>
>> quinn wrote
>>
>>>> It would make sense if she was named "Jamie" to honor the maternal
>>>> family name "James", and then friends would pick up on that. I had a
>>>
>>> Do you have evidence of such distortions of family names being a thing?
>>
>> Naming daughters with a feminised version of either a male relative's
>> forename, or a family surname, was once fashionable in Scotland.
>>
>> I've met a Donaldina,Jamesina and the unfortunate Archibelle, whose
>> mother's family name was Archibald.

> My mother's name was Theadora...she was named for her grandfather
> Theadore....r

I've known a Theodora, am currently reading a book by a Theodora, and
don't consider it an unusual name in anyway. Before Harry Potter it was
certainly more familiar to me than Hermione.

The built in dictionary on this UNIX system knows Theodora, but
considers Hermione a misspelt word.

I am not sure I've seen it with your spelling, but I am not sure I've
not.

--
You could save people. You could get there in the nick of time. And
something could snap its fingers and say, no , it has to be that way.
Let me tell you how it has to be. This is how the legend goes. --Soul
Music
Loading...