Post by Cheryl Post by Quinn C Post by Wayne Brown Post by Quinn C Post by Wayne Brown Post by Quinn C Post by Mack A. Damia
I detest this commercial. What does that even mean?
As others have said, "being all about X" is overused these days. I
find it mildly annoying, a little less than e.g. "best X ever", a
verdict that may easily last hours.
Post by Mack A. Damia
Not only that, a woman with a bad case of vocal fry says it at the
beginning of the commercial. I abhor vocal fry.
I hope you're not one of those apparently many people who abhor
vocal fry specifically in women, and often don't even notice it in
How would we know we are one of those if we don't notice it?
Well, now that I pointed out this possibility, you could pay more
attention and find out.
Post by Wayne Brown
any case, what would be wrong with that?
You may not have noticed, but there was a whole conversation on
about how women who speak in public, whether they are TV and radio
personalities, politicians, YouTubers or podcasters, get
criticized for their voices much more often than men. Sometimes
they get criticized for things that are more typical for female
voices - like being "shrill" -, but sometimes for things that
aren't gender-specific, like vocal fry, for which men don't get
There is a suspicion that at least part of this imbalance is due
to listeners being uncomfortable with women voicing opinions in
I missed that other discussion, which is probably just as well.
In recent years I've grown quite weary of and unsympathetic to claims
of bias due to things like "listeners being uncomfortable with women
voicing opinions in public."
Weary - I totally understand. Even more I'm weary that there is
still reason to have such suspicions, even thought it's often
difficult to prove them in specific cases, which makes these
discussions so unpleasant.
Post by Wayne Brown Post by Quinn C Post by Wayne Brown
The sounds would presumably
be different so I could imagine some liking one sound but abhoring
Like liking men wearing pants, but abhorring women who do so?
These judgments are not always purely aesthetic.
Women wearing pants doesn't bother me. And I certainly don't approve
of abhorring women for that (or any other) reason. Abhoring people
in general is not wise, much less for so inconsequential a reason. But
I don't have a problem with someone abhorring the _practice_ of women
wearing pants. They have the right to their opinions.
Sure - in fact, I find that a rather bland thing to say. I also
have the right to point out they're being sexist - not as an
opinion, but rather by definition - and that therefore I'd be
hesitant having any dealings with them.
Logically, if you're not going to have any dealings with people who have
certain opinions, you shouldn't be communicating with them at all, not
even to point out your reasons for excluding them.
I'm not sure logic is the best approach to this question, but
while we're there, I'd like to point out that I didn't say "point
out to them". In fact, I was pointing out to Wayne that those
people are sexist, in order to tell Wayne that "having a right to
one's opinion" isn't the most relevant question to me.
You have the right to your opinion, but some opinions are wrong,
and some are despicable, either to me personally, or, in my view,
detrimental to society and should therefore be met with
Apart from that, in the practical world, it is a likely scenario
that I already have dealings with people and then I find out that
they're sexist (or racist etc.), and then it might be useful to
indicate to them that's the reason I'm uncomfortable, and don't
feel like pursuing the relationship further.
But this wouldn't be automatic either, so it would be better to
say that this point has the potential to be the principal reason
for me avoiding a person.
Post by Cheryl
I think I've finally figured out what "vocal fry' is, and I can't say it
bothers me all that much.
I recently watched the first season of Master of None. In Episode
5, there is a scene where the hero is about to have sex with a
woman, but retreats when he finds out she's married. In this very
awkward situation, I noticed lot of vocal fry from both
participants. Around 9:30 min, for people who have access to it
Post by Cheryl
What does annoy me is the high-pitched squeal
of excitement some women feel impelled to produce when they see a
friend, or spot something good on sale. I think it's a generational
thing; women much younger than me seem to be far more likely to do it
than women of my own age are. I think it must have been thought of as
cute when they were little girls, and they never got out of the habit.
That's far more annoying than vocal fry.
I wouldn't have thought that's the reason. It seems to be
something that's cultivated in pop culture, and I expect most
people are copying it from there, but there's still the question
why it arose in pop culture in the first place, and
infantilization is a possibility. Growing up has become more and
more unpopular over the last decades.
Software is getting slower
more rapidly than hardware becomes faster