Discussion:
Joy's website (Was Re: Lift v. Elevator question for Brits)
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Lewis
2017-10-01 12:04:02 UTC
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Hey Joy, I had a quick and simple suggestion for your website that
involves adding just a few of lines and I think would make your pages
easier for people to read, especially on the current crop of screens
that are 2000 pixels (or more!) wide:

In the <head>

<style> div {width: 40em; margin: 0 auto; } </style>

Then, right after <body> add a <div> and right before </body> add a
</div>

Play with the value until the width "looks good"

One nice thing about this is that if someone increases the text size
for readability, it keeps the over-all line length the same.

Here's a screenshot of what it looks like:

<Loading Image...
--
For a very few, the sky's the limit. And, sometimes, not even that.
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2017-10-01 12:30:58 UTC
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Post by Lewis
Hey Joy, I had a quick and simple suggestion for your website that
involves adding just a few of lines and I think would make your pages
easier for people to read, especially on the current crop of screens
In the <head>
<style> div {width: 40em; margin: 0 auto; } </style>
Then, right after <body> add a <div> and right before </body> add a
</div>
Play with the value until the width "looks good"
One nice thing about this is that if someone increases the text size
for readability, it keeps the over-all line length the same.
<https://www.dropbox.com/s/y07sg8bpatvtrpi/Screenshot%202017-10-01%2005.58.52.png?dl=0>
OK, that's a geekish opinion, but I find Joy's pages just fine as they
are. She obviously thinks content is more important than design, and so
do I. I don't often use iCab any more on my portable (though I use it
in my office) because it crashes too often with modern versions of the
OS, but I tried it on Joy's pages and it agrees that there is nothing
wrong with them: it displays a green smiley face on pages it likes,
which means on extremely few pages. It displays a red scowling face on
yours, but that may be Dropbox's fault rather than yours.
--
athel
Lewis
2017-10-01 14:39:31 UTC
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Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Lewis
Hey Joy, I had a quick and simple suggestion for your website that
involves adding just a few of lines and I think would make your pages
easier for people to read, especially on the current crop of screens
In the <head>
<style> div {width: 40em; margin: 0 auto; } </style>
Then, right after <body> add a <div> and right before </body> add a
</div>
Play with the value until the width "looks good"
One nice thing about this is that if someone increases the text size
for readability, it keeps the over-all line length the same.
<https://www.dropbox.com/s/y07sg8bpatvtrpi/Screenshot%202017-10-01%2005.58.52.png?dl=0>
OK, that's a geekish opinion, but I find Joy's pages just fine as they
are.
If you have a large screen and a browser setup for things like Youtube (wide)
then the page is largely unreadable as the text will span the entire width of
the page.
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
it agrees that there is nothing wrong with them: it displays a green smiley
face on pages it likes,
I never said there was anything wrong with the page. I suggested a very slight
change that would improve the page.
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
which means on extremely few pages. It displays a red scowling face on
yours, but that may be Dropbox's fault rather than yours.
I posted an image on Dropbox, there is no HTML or CSS that I posted anywhere.

The code that I suggested is entirely compliant.
--
By the way, I think you might be the prettiest girl I've ever seen
outside the pages of a really filthy magazine
John Dunlop
2017-10-02 14:45:25 UTC
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Post by Lewis
Hey Joy, I had a quick and simple suggestion for your website that
involves adding just a few of lines and I think would make your pages
easier for people to read, especially on the current crop of screens
In the <head>
<style> div {width: 40em; margin: 0 auto; } </style>
Or for more fluidity, set the "max-width" property. But yes, the idea is
sound, and one I wish more authors would adopt.

(Note that if the author is using HTML older than version 5, as someone
who is still marking up pages by hand may well be, the "type" attribute
of the STYLE element is required.)
--
John
Joy Beeson
2017-10-06 13:30:34 UTC
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On Sun, 1 Oct 2017 12:04:02 -0000 (UTC), Lewis
Post by Lewis
Hey Joy, I had a quick and simple suggestion for your website that
involves adding just a few of lines and I think would make your pages
easier for people to read, especially on the current crop of screens
In the <head>
<style> div {width: 40em; margin: 0 auto; } </style>
Then, right after <body> add a <div> and right before </body> add a
</div>
Play with the value until the width "looks good"
One nice thing about this is that if someone increases the text size
for readability, it keeps the over-all line length the same.
<https://www.dropbox.com/s/y07sg8bpatvtrpi/Screenshot%202017-10-01%2005.58.52.png?dl=0>
Since I browse and read news on different computers, I've just now (4
October) gotten around to looking at the screenshot. I had to click
"view image" to see the whole thing, and Dropbox was reluctant to let
me do that. I'm glad I don't need Dropbox!

I added the div code to my current diary, which is on the Web, but not
linked. (I e-mail the URL
<http://wlweather.net/LETTERS/2017BANN/OCTBAN17.HTM> to immediate
family when it's finished.) When viewing it, the lines ran off the
right edge of the page before the type size got up to
cataract-friendly.

<Loading Image...>
<Loading Image...>

I see that the problem is in measuring the line in ems; when the type
gets bigger, the em gets bigger.

Then I validated it. As noted downthread, the code needs the word
"type" in there somewhere.

I'll experiment with the "maximum length" suggested downthread when I
get time. (It's nap time now; may not send this until tomorrow.) When
it's worked out, only new pages and newly marked-up* pages will get
it.

* a large percentage of Rough Sewing is still in plain text.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

<Loading Image...>
<Loading Image...>

"Max width" did the trick.

Then I had a long talk with W3C; I never bothered to learn anything
but paragraphs, headers, links, images, and Table of Contents, so it
took some fumbling around to figure out that "type" belongs inside the
angle brackets with "style".

Validating didn't change the appearance, except for deleting a stray
horizontal rule that somehow wandered in, so I didn't take another
screenshot.
--
Joy Beeson, U.S.A., mostly central Hoosier,
some Northern Indiana, Upstate New York, Florida, and Hawaii
joy beeson at comcast dot net http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/
The above message is a Usenet post.
I don't recall having given anyone permission to use it on a Web site.
Snidely
2017-10-11 09:27:07 UTC
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Post by Joy Beeson
On Sun, 1 Oct 2017 12:04:02 -0000 (UTC), Lewis
Post by Lewis
Hey Joy, I had a quick and simple suggestion for your website that
involves adding just a few of lines and I think would make your pages
easier for people to read, especially on the current crop of screens
In the <head>
<style> div {width: 40em; margin: 0 auto; } </style>
Then, right after <body> add a <div> and right before </body> add a
</div>
Play with the value until the width "looks good"
One nice thing about this is that if someone increases the text size
for readability, it keeps the over-all line length the same.
<https://www.dropbox.com/s/y07sg8bpatvtrpi/Screenshot%202017-10-01%2005.58.52.png?dl=0>
Since I browse and read news on different computers, I've just now (4
October) gotten around to looking at the screenshot. I had to click
"view image" to see the whole thing,
I didn't. There was a button to go to full-screen, and two other
buttons for zoom +/-. At the unzoomed size, I could almost read the
text.
Post by Joy Beeson
and Dropbox was reluctant to let
me do that.
I didn't have any problem with the buttons, but maybe Dropbox remembers
that I have an account (even though I'm not running the client).
Post by Joy Beeson
I'm glad I don't need Dropbox!
Dropbox's sins are more in the nature of recent changes to drop support
for a default public folder.
Post by Joy Beeson
I added the div code to my current diary, which is on the Web, but not
linked. (I e-mail the URL
<http://wlweather.net/LETTERS/2017BANN/OCTBAN17.HTM> to immediate
family when it's finished.) When viewing it, the lines ran off the
right edge of the page before the type size got up to
cataract-friendly.
Were you using browser zoom feature, or changing the font size.

BTW, when I followed your link at the bottom, the display was just fine
for me, but my lenses are still mostly clear (a few cells may have gone
full apoptosis, but most are still in the normal barely-alive state
that allows them to be clear). Presbyopia is a factor for me, but
arm's length is where they're happym and I believe that a comfortable
size of 'e' at that distance is about 1mm. (I don't seem to have a
ruler in reach.)
Post by Joy Beeson
<http://wlweather.net/LETTERS/2017BANN/SCRNSHT1.JPG>
<http://wlweather.net/LETTERS/2017BANN/SCRNSHT2.JPG>
I see that the problem is in measuring the line in ems; when the type
gets bigger, the em gets bigger.
If you're using the same font, but zooming the browser, it's the
apparent size of the em, sorta like when using a magnifying glass on
physical print. The apparent size of a page (if the magnifying glass
had enough area and no edge effects) wouldn't fit in the book anymore.

/dps
--
But happiness cannot be pursued; it must ensue. One must have a reason
to 'be happy.'"
Viktor Frankl
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