Discussion:
There was three kings into the east...
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Harrison Hill
2018-07-03 15:40:47 UTC
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Americans are often perplexed by us Brits using "The police were" vs
"The police was", so how about:

"There was three kings into the east..."?

I've had this in my vocabulary since I was a teenager - from a Folk
Song - but had no idea until today that it is Burns:

<https://www.davidpbrown.co.uk/poetry/robert-burns.html>
Peter T. Daniels
2018-07-03 15:52:30 UTC
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Post by Harrison Hill
Americans are often perplexed by us Brits using "The police were" vs
Hunh? What is "the police was ..." supposed to be?

(Thought I'd beat Athel to it.)

The anomaly is using plural verbs with singular team names. "Man U was."
Vs. "the Yankees/Cubs/Dodgers/Giants were" and "the Utah Jazz/Miami Heat
was."
Post by Harrison Hill
"There was three kings into the east..."?
I've had this in my vocabulary since I was a teenager - from a Folk
<https://www.davidpbrown.co.uk/poetry/robert-burns.html>
Colonel Edmund J. Burke
2018-07-03 15:54:00 UTC
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Post by Harrison Hill
Americans are often perplexed by us Brits using "The police were" vs
"There was three kings into the east..."?
I've had this in my vocabulary since I was a teenager - from a Folk
<https://www.davidpbrown.co.uk/poetry/robert-burns.html>
FAGGOT
Peter Young
2018-07-03 16:06:42 UTC
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Post by Harrison Hill
Americans are often perplexed by us Brits using "The police were" vs
"There was three kings into the east..."?
I've had this in my vocabulary since I was a teenager - from a Folk
<https://www.davidpbrown.co.uk/poetry/robert-burns.html>
Wouldn't do in modern BrE, I think. However, in 19th Century BrE the noun
"police" was singular. "The police is ...". And of course for Shakespeare
"news" was plural, "these news", so these things do change.

Peter.
--
Peter Young, (BrE, RP), Consultant Anaesthetist, 1975-2004.
(US equivalent: Certified Anesthesiologist) (AUE Pt)
Cheltenham and Gloucester, UK. Now happily retired.
http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk
the Omrud
2018-07-03 17:58:32 UTC
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Post by Peter Young
Post by Harrison Hill
Americans are often perplexed by us Brits using "The police were" vs
"There was three kings into the east..."?
I've had this in my vocabulary since I was a teenager - from a Folk
<https://www.davidpbrown.co.uk/poetry/robert-burns.html>
Wouldn't do in modern BrE, I think. However, in 19th Century BrE the noun
"police" was singular. "The police is ...". And of course for Shakespeare
"news" was plural, "these news", so these things do change.
Plural of "new", presumably.

"Police" is still singular in other European languages.
--
David
Peter Young
2018-07-03 20:05:35 UTC
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Post by the Omrud
Post by Peter Young
Post by Harrison Hill
Americans are often perplexed by us Brits using "The police were" vs
"There was three kings into the east..."?
I've had this in my vocabulary since I was a teenager - from a Folk
<https://www.davidpbrown.co.uk/poetry/robert-burns.html>
Wouldn't do in modern BrE, I think. However, in 19th Century BrE the noun
"police" was singular. "The police is ...". And of course for Shakespeare
"news" was plural, "these news", so these things do change.
Plural of "new", presumably.
I imagine so
Post by the Omrud
"Police" is still singular in other European languages.
Yet another thing for the "I didn't know that" box.

Peter.
--
Peter Young, (BrE, RP), Consultant Anaesthetist, 1975-2004.
(US equivalent: Certified Anesthesiologist) (AUE Pt)
Cheltenham and Gloucester, UK. Now happily retired.
http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk
Jerry Friedman
2018-07-03 22:24:42 UTC
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Post by Peter Young
Post by Harrison Hill
Americans are often perplexed by us Brits using "The police were" vs
"There was three kings into the east..."?
I've had this in my vocabulary since I was a teenager - from a Folk
<https://www.davidpbrown.co.uk/poetry/robert-burns.html>
Wouldn't do in modern BrE, I think.
Normal around here (northern New Mexico) in colloquial AmE. I don't
know how widespread it is.
Post by Peter Young
However, in 19th Century BrE the noun
"police" was singular. "The police is ...". And of course for Shakespeare
"news" was plural, "these news", so these things do change.
Okay, what's going on with "this" and "are"?

"And this England are so young, and they've played thus far with such
kind of optimism, with verve and joy."

Roger Bennett, who has an English accent, in an interview on U.S.
National Public Radio on June 29.

https://www.npr.org/2018/06/29/624789715/remaining-teams-move-on-to-knockout-stage-of-world-cup

And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup scores
with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."

https://www.npr.org/2018/06/18/620939115/reaction-to-mexicos-soccer-goal-moved-the-earth-literally

How quaint. But we play soccer here too. Maybe not as well, but we
don't have to pretend we're British. The last time around, an NPR
announcer editorialized against the practice.

https://www.npr.org/2014/07/07/329585162/nil-ism-in-america-when-you-stare-at-the-pitch-the-pitch-stares-back

"Nil-ism", I point out.
--
Jerry Friedman
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-07-03 22:57:05 UTC
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Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Peter Young
Post by Harrison Hill
Americans are often perplexed by us Brits using "The police were" vs
"There was three kings into the east..."?
I've had this in my vocabulary since I was a teenager - from a Folk
<https://www.davidpbrown.co.uk/poetry/robert-burns.html>
Wouldn't do in modern BrE, I think.
Normal around here (northern New Mexico) in colloquial AmE. I don't
know how widespread it is.
Post by Peter Young
However, in 19th Century BrE the noun
"police" was singular. "The police is ...". And of course for Shakespeare
"news" was plural, "these news", so these things do change.
Okay, what's going on with "this" and "are"?
"And this England are so young, and they've played thus far with such
kind of optimism, with verve and joy."
Roger Bennett, who has an English accent, in an interview on U.S.
National Public Radio on June 29.
https://www.npr.org/2018/06/29/624789715/remaining-teams-move-on-to-knockout-stage-of-world-cup
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup scores
with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
https://www.npr.org/2018/06/18/620939115/reaction-to-mexicos-soccer-goal-moved-the-earth-literally
How quaint. But we play soccer here too. Maybe not as well, but we
don't have to pretend we're British. The last time around, an NPR
announcer editorialized against the practice.
https://www.npr.org/2014/07/07/329585162/nil-ism-in-america-when-you-stare-at-the-pitch-the-pitch-stares-back
"Nil-ism", I point out.
It's the terminology of the sport. Proper respect for the game requires you
to say 'nil'. To fail to do so is simply to highlight another example of
isolationism and hubris. How would you react if we started reporting on
American sports using exclusively British terms?
Jerry Friedman
2018-07-04 01:59:29 UTC
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[soccer]
Post by Madrigal Gurneyhalt
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup scores
with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
https://www.npr.org/2018/06/18/620939115/reaction-to-mexicos-soccer-goal-moved-the-earth-literally
How quaint. But we play soccer here too. Maybe not as well, but we
don't have to pretend we're British. The last time around, an NPR
announcer editorialized against the practice.
https://www.npr.org/2014/07/07/329585162/nil-ism-in-america-when-you-stare-at-the-pitch-the-pitch-stares-back
"Nil-ism", I point out.
It's the terminology of the sport. Proper respect for the game requires you
to say 'nil'. To fail to do so is simply to highlight another example of
isolationism and hubris. How would you react if we started reporting on
American sports using exclusively British terms?
Like saying the Browns lost a game fourteen-nil, or Joe Thomas is a big
bloke at over 44 stone, or a racquetball (so spelled even here) player
hit a good zed-ball? I can't imagine being bothered by that. (Stone
are kind of funny, though.)
--
Jerry Friedman
Jerry Friedman
2018-07-04 02:04:25 UTC
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Post by Jerry Friedman
[soccer]
Post by Madrigal Gurneyhalt
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup scores
with "nil".  E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
https://www.npr.org/2018/06/18/620939115/reaction-to-mexicos-soccer-goal-moved-the-earth-literally
How quaint.  But we play soccer here too.  Maybe not as well, but we
don't have to pretend we're British.  The last time around, an NPR
announcer editorialized against the practice.
https://www.npr.org/2014/07/07/329585162/nil-ism-in-america-when-you-stare-at-the-pitch-the-pitch-stares-back
"Nil-ism", I point out.
It's the terminology of the sport. Proper respect for the game requires you
to say 'nil'. To fail to do so is simply to highlight another example of
isolationism and hubris. How would you react if we started reporting on
American sports using exclusively British terms?
Like saying the Browns lost a game fourteen-nil, or Joe Thomas is a big
bloke at over 44 stone,
I mean 22 stone.
Post by Jerry Friedman
or a racquetball (so spelled even here) player
hit a good zed-ball?  I can't imagine being bothered by that.  (Stone
are kind of funny, though.)
--
Jerry Friedman
Jerry Friedman
2018-07-04 03:24:45 UTC
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Post by Jerry Friedman
[soccer]
Post by Madrigal Gurneyhalt
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup scores
with "nil".  E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
https://www.npr.org/2018/06/18/620939115/reaction-to-mexicos-soccer-goal-moved-the-earth-literally
How quaint.  But we play soccer here too.  Maybe not as well, but we
don't have to pretend we're British.  The last time around, an NPR
announcer editorialized against the practice.
https://www.npr.org/2014/07/07/329585162/nil-ism-in-america-when-you-stare-at-the-pitch-the-pitch-stares-back
"Nil-ism", I point out.
It's the terminology of the sport. Proper respect for the game requires you
to say 'nil'. To fail to do so is simply to highlight another example of
isolationism and hubris. How would you react if we started reporting on
American sports using exclusively British terms?
Like saying the Browns lost a game fourteen-nil
[...]

Never mind. I just didn't get the joke.
--
Jerry Friedman
Peter T. Daniels
2018-07-04 04:06:45 UTC
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Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Peter Young
Post by Harrison Hill
Americans are often perplexed by us Brits using "The police were" vs
"There was three kings into the east..."?
I've had this in my vocabulary since I was a teenager - from a Folk
<https://www.davidpbrown.co.uk/poetry/robert-burns.html>
Wouldn't do in modern BrE, I think.
Normal around here (northern New Mexico) in colloquial AmE. I don't
know how widespread it is.
Post by Peter Young
However, in 19th Century BrE the noun
"police" was singular. "The police is ...". And of course for Shakespeare
"news" was plural, "these news", so these things do change.
Okay, what's going on with "this" and "are"?
"And this England are so young, and they've played thus far with such
kind of optimism, with verve and joy."
Roger Bennett, who has an English accent, in an interview on U.S.
National Public Radio on June 29.
He's been checking in regularly with Brian Lehrer on WNYC. Today he
revealed that he is now a US citizen, but he still did refer to the
England upset in the first person plural.
Post by Jerry Friedman
https://www.npr.org/2018/06/29/624789715/remaining-teams-move-on-to-knockout-stage-of-world-cup
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup scores
with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
We understand it to be a technical term in soccer. Which Mr. Bennett
pointed out the other day was the perfectly ordinary British term for
the sport (Association Football, contracted at Oxford, just like "rugger"
for the rougher game) until ca. 1994 when they suddenly noticed that that
was what the Americans were calling it.
Post by Jerry Friedman
https://www.npr.org/2018/06/18/620939115/reaction-to-mexicos-soccer-goal-moved-the-earth-literally
How quaint. But we play soccer here too. Maybe not as well, but we
don't have to pretend we're British. The last time around, an NPR
announcer editorialized against the practice.
https://www.npr.org/2014/07/07/329585162/nil-ism-in-america-when-you-stare-at-the-pitch-the-pitch-stares-back
"Nil-ism", I point out.
Peter Moylan
2018-07-04 05:53:20 UTC
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Post by Jerry Friedman
Okay, what's going on with "this" and "are"?
"And this England are so young, and they've played thus far with
such kind of optimism, with verve and joy."
Roger Bennett, who has an English accent, in an interview on U.S.
National Public Radio on June 29.
He's using "England" as an abbreviation for "English team".
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
Thanks.

A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW, Australia
Mark Brader
2018-07-04 08:46:57 UTC
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Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
--
Mark Brader | "Red lights are not my concern.
Toronto | I am a driver, not a policeman."
***@vex.net | --statement made after collision, 1853

My text in this article is in the public domain.
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-07-04 09:55:13 UTC
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Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
--
The master of (proper) football commentary would never countenance
such awful prolixity ....



... nor should anyone else!
Jerry Friedman
2018-07-04 13:21:34 UTC
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Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
Down here I think you'd also hear "one-zero" in the media. As kids we
often said "one-zip".
--
Jerry Friedman
John Varela
2018-07-04 22:52:29 UTC
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Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
--
John Varela
RH Draney
2018-07-05 03:44:11 UTC
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Post by John Varela
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
Too easy to mistake that for "one-all", the usual way of indicating a
tied score....r
John Varela
2018-07-07 02:08:48 UTC
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Post by RH Draney
Post by John Varela
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
Too easy to mistake that for "one-all", the usual way of indicating a
tied score....r
"Oh" doesn't sound much like "all" the way I say it, nor do they
sound alike when spoken by people I know.
--
John Varela
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-07-07 11:31:58 UTC
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Post by John Varela
Post by RH Draney
Post by John Varela
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
Too easy to mistake that for "one-all", the usual way of indicating a
tied score....r
"Oh" doesn't sound much like "all" the way I say it, nor do they
sound alike when spoken by people I know.
Maybe not but how many times do people append 'green grow
the rushes-oh' to your pronouncements?

It's nil in football, and nought in cricket, and blasphemy to say otherwise!
Peter Moylan
2018-07-07 12:18:37 UTC
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Post by Madrigal Gurneyhalt
It's nil in football, and nought in cricket, and blasphemy to say otherwise!
I've never witnessed that third sport.

In my experience: love in tennis, nil in soccer, and it simply can't
happen in any other sport unless the teams are seriously mismatched.
--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW, Australia
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2018-07-07 12:50:15 UTC
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Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Madrigal Gurneyhalt
It's nil in football, and nought in cricket, and blasphemy to say otherwise!
I've never witnessed that third sport.
In my experience: love in tennis, nil in soccer, and it simply can't
happen in any other sport unless the teams are seriously mismatched.
Yes. Even in rugby and basketball the losing team gets more than zero.
However, the only time I played squash I failed to win a single point.
I decided that squash wasn't really my thing.
--
athel
Peter T. Daniels
2018-07-07 13:33:52 UTC
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Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Madrigal Gurneyhalt
It's nil in football, and nought in cricket, and blasphemy to say otherwise!
I've never witnessed that third sport.
In my experience: love in tennis, nil in soccer, and it simply can't
happen in any other sport unless the teams are seriously mismatched.
Shutouts are common in baseball and not rare in hockey.
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-07-07 13:46:47 UTC
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Post by Peter T. Daniels
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Madrigal Gurneyhalt
It's nil in football, and nought in cricket, and blasphemy to say otherwise!
I've never witnessed that third sport.
In my experience: love in tennis, nil in soccer, and it simply can't
happen in any other sport unless the teams are seriously mismatched.
Shutouts are common in baseball and not rare in hockey.
There were 11 in the NFL this past season including a 0-6 result
so no mismatch there.
Mark Brader
2018-07-07 19:27:20 UTC
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Post by Peter Moylan
In my experience: love in tennis, nil in soccer, and it simply can't
happen in any other sport unless the teams are seriously mismatched.
Shutouts are reasonably common both in hockey (called "ice hockey"
in some countries) and not exactly rare in baseball. The 2016 World
Series, which ran to the maximum 7 games, included 6-0 and 1-0 wins
for Cleveland, who lost the series.

Anyway, scores *during* a game can include zeroes in any sport where
they start at 0-0 and count points upward. In the Argos' first game this
season, they took a 1-0 lead early in the first quarter but lost 27-19.
--
Mark Brader | "What a marvelous mixture of proliferating inconvenience
Toronto | and downright helpfulness!"
***@vex.net | --Steve Summit

My text in this article is in the public domain.
RH Draney
2018-07-07 22:40:37 UTC
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Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
In my experience: love in tennis, nil in soccer, and it simply can't
happen in any other sport unless the teams are seriously mismatched.
Shutouts are reasonably common both in hockey (called "ice hockey"
in some countries) and not exactly rare in baseball. The 2016 World
Series, which ran to the maximum 7 games, included 6-0 and 1-0 wins
for Cleveland, who lost the series.
Anyway, scores *during* a game can include zeroes in any sport where
they start at 0-0 and count points upward. In the Argos' first game this
season, they took a 1-0 lead early in the first quarter but lost 27-19.
In darts, though, a zero can only occur at the end of a match....r
bill van
2018-07-07 22:58:42 UTC
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Post by RH Draney
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
In my experience: love in tennis, nil in soccer, and it simply can't
happen in any other sport unless the teams are seriously mismatched.
Shutouts are reasonably common both in hockey (called "ice hockey"
in some countries) and not exactly rare in baseball. The 2016 World
Series, which ran to the maximum 7 games, included 6-0 and 1-0 wins
for Cleveland, who lost the series.
Anyway, scores *during* a game can include zeroes in any sport where
they start at 0-0 and count points upward. In the Argos' first game this
season, they took a 1-0 lead early in the first quarter but lost 27-19.
In darts, though, a zero can only occur at the end of a match....r
Not only that, it's the winning score.
John Varela
2018-07-08 00:03:11 UTC
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On Sat, 7 Jul 2018 11:31:58 UTC, Madrigal Gurneyhalt
Post by Madrigal Gurneyhalt
Post by John Varela
Post by RH Draney
Post by John Varela
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
Too easy to mistake that for "one-all", the usual way of indicating a
tied score....r
"Oh" doesn't sound much like "all" the way I say it, nor do they
sound alike when spoken by people I know.
Maybe not but how many times do people append 'green grow
the rushes-oh' to your pronouncements?
Never once. And I haven't heard that song since I was in college.
Post by Madrigal Gurneyhalt
It's nil in football, and nought in cricket, and blasphemy to say otherwise!
I can't imagine wanting to learn a soccer or cricket score, so you
can announce the scores any way you want and it won't bother me.

That's the three-oh mark for tonight.
--
John Varela
Ken Blake
2018-07-08 14:47:56 UTC
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Post by John Varela
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
I always try to pronounce the numeral 0 as "zero." To me "oh" is a
letter, not a number.
bill van
2018-07-08 18:35:00 UTC
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Post by Ken Blake
Post by John Varela
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
I always try to pronounce the numeral 0 as "zero." To me "oh" is a
letter, not a number.
So do I, usually. It avoids confusion between the number and the
letter. But there are
exceptions. The main telephone area code for Vancouver is 604, and
absolutely everyone
says it as "six-oh-four".

bill
Ken Blake
2018-07-08 19:00:11 UTC
Reply
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Post by bill van
Post by Ken Blake
Post by John Varela
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
I always try to pronounce the numeral 0 as "zero." To me "oh" is a
letter, not a number.
So do I, usually. It avoids confusion between the number and the
letter.
Yes, especially since there are places where it could be either a
number or a letter.
Post by bill van
But there are
exceptions. The main telephone area code for Vancouver is 604, and
absolutely everyone
says it as "six-oh-four".
I guess I'm not included in that "absolutely everyone" since I've
never had occasion to say it. But if I did, I would say
"six-zero-four."

I live in Tucson, where the area code is 520. Probably the great
majority of Tucsonans say "five-two-oh," but I don't.
David Kleinecke
2018-07-08 20:18:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Ken Blake
Post by bill van
Post by Ken Blake
Post by John Varela
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
I always try to pronounce the numeral 0 as "zero." To me "oh" is a
letter, not a number.
So do I, usually. It avoids confusion between the number and the
letter.
Yes, especially since there are places where it could be either a
number or a letter.
Post by bill van
But there are
exceptions. The main telephone area code for Vancouver is 604, and
absolutely everyone
says it as "six-oh-four".
I guess I'm not included in that "absolutely everyone" since I've
never had occasion to say it. But if I did, I would say
"six-zero-four."
I live in Tucson, where the area code is 520. Probably the great
majority of Tucsonans say "five-two-oh," but I don't.
I'm in 95540 and I say nine-fifty-five-forty. I have no
idea what the commonest form is. We don\t talk about
zip codes much.
Peter T. Daniels
2018-07-09 04:09:54 UTC
Reply
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Raw Message
Post by David Kleinecke
Post by Ken Blake
Post by bill van
Post by Ken Blake
Post by John Varela
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
I always try to pronounce the numeral 0 as "zero." To me "oh" is a
letter, not a number.
So do I, usually. It avoids confusion between the number and the
letter.
Yes, especially since there are places where it could be either a
number or a letter.
Post by bill van
But there are
exceptions. The main telephone area code for Vancouver is 604, and
absolutely everyone
says it as "six-oh-four".
I guess I'm not included in that "absolutely everyone" since I've
never had occasion to say it. But if I did, I would say
"six-zero-four."
I live in Tucson, where the area code is 520. Probably the great
majority of Tucsonans say "five-two-oh," but I don't.
I'm in 95540 and I say nine-fifty-five-forty. I have no
That would give anyone immense pause.
Post by David Kleinecke
idea what the commonest form is. We don\t talk about
zip codes much.
Normal people say the digits. There's a well-known TV show, Beverly Hills
Nine Oh Two One Oh. Its fans referred to it as Nine Oh Two One Oh.

The first three digits are your region, the last two are your locality,
assigned roughly alphabetically (unless they were taken over from existing
city zones, as in NY and Chi).
Paul Wolff
2018-07-08 22:11:16 UTC
Reply
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Raw Message
Post by Ken Blake
Post by bill van
Post by Ken Blake
Post by John Varela
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
I always try to pronounce the numeral 0 as "zero." To me "oh" is a
letter, not a number.
So do I, usually. It avoids confusion between the number and the
letter.
Yes, especially since there are places where it could be either a
number or a letter.
Post by bill van
But there are
exceptions. The main telephone area code for Vancouver is 604, and
absolutely everyone
says it as "six-oh-four".
I guess I'm not included in that "absolutely everyone" since I've
never had occasion to say it. But if I did, I would say
"six-zero-four."
I live in Tucson, where the area code is 520. Probably the great
majority of Tucsonans say "five-two-oh," but I don't.
I could be wrong (as if!) but hereabouts road numbers with four digits
(that's excluding the initial letter, M, A or B) are said digit by
digit, with "oh" for zero. So the A4074 is "A (voiced) four oh seven
four". With one or two digits, the number is given as a normal number -
the A34 is the "A (voiced) thirty-four". With three digit numbers, I
haven't yet determined a speech pattern (the A four-twenty, the A three
four three, etc).

My phone, the one with a built-in computer complete with web browser,
lets me get driving directions from a voce supplied by Google. It's
inclined to state road numbers by full number where I'd expect a
breakdown - so, in the above three-digit examples, "A four hundred and
twenty" and "A three hundred and forty three".

But I haven't got lab notebooks to prove it. So far, it's an impression
only. Am I alone in this thought? If it's true, maybe it reflects AmE
practice.
--
Paul
Tony Cooper
2018-07-08 23:50:14 UTC
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On Sun, 8 Jul 2018 23:11:16 +0100, Paul Wolff
Post by Paul Wolff
Post by Ken Blake
Post by bill van
Post by Ken Blake
Post by John Varela
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
I always try to pronounce the numeral 0 as "zero." To me "oh" is a
letter, not a number.
So do I, usually. It avoids confusion between the number and the
letter.
Yes, especially since there are places where it could be either a
number or a letter.
Post by bill van
But there are
exceptions. The main telephone area code for Vancouver is 604, and
absolutely everyone
says it as "six-oh-four".
I guess I'm not included in that "absolutely everyone" since I've
never had occasion to say it. But if I did, I would say
"six-zero-four."
I live in Tucson, where the area code is 520. Probably the great
majority of Tucsonans say "five-two-oh," but I don't.
I could be wrong (as if!) but hereabouts road numbers with four digits
(that's excluding the initial letter, M, A or B) are said digit by
digit, with "oh" for zero. So the A4074 is "A (voiced) four oh seven
four". With one or two digits, the number is given as a normal number -
the A34 is the "A (voiced) thirty-four". With three digit numbers, I
haven't yet determined a speech pattern (the A four-twenty, the A three
four three, etc).
My phone, the one with a built-in computer complete with web browser,
lets me get driving directions from a voce supplied by Google. It's
inclined to state road numbers by full number where I'd expect a
breakdown - so, in the above three-digit examples, "A four hundred and
twenty" and "A three hundred and forty three".
But I haven't got lab notebooks to prove it. So far, it's an impression
only. Am I alone in this thought? If it's true, maybe it reflects AmE
practice.
There is an East/West tollway in this area that is SR 408. ("SR"
means "state road") The radio traffic reports inform about conditions
on "the four oh eight".
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
RH Draney
2018-07-09 04:46:45 UTC
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Post by Tony Cooper
On Sun, 8 Jul 2018 23:11:16 +0100, Paul Wolff
Post by Paul Wolff
Post by Ken Blake
I live in Tucson, where the area code is 520. Probably the great
majority of Tucsonans say "five-two-oh," but I don't.
I could be wrong (as if!) but hereabouts road numbers with four digits
(that's excluding the initial letter, M, A or B) are said digit by
digit, with "oh" for zero. So the A4074 is "A (voiced) four oh seven
four". With one or two digits, the number is given as a normal number -
the A34 is the "A (voiced) thirty-four". With three digit numbers, I
haven't yet determined a speech pattern (the A four-twenty, the A three
four three, etc).
My phone, the one with a built-in computer complete with web browser,
lets me get driving directions from a voce supplied by Google. It's
inclined to state road numbers by full number where I'd expect a
breakdown - so, in the above three-digit examples, "A four hundred and
twenty" and "A three hundred and forty three".
But I haven't got lab notebooks to prove it. So far, it's an impression
only. Am I alone in this thought? If it's true, maybe it reflects AmE
practice.
There is an East/West tollway in this area that is SR 408. ("SR"
means "state road") The radio traffic reports inform about conditions
on "the four oh eight".
The usual US practice is to break numbers into pairs of digits and state
each pair as if it were a separate number...if an odd number of digits,
the first stands alone and the remainder are paired...thus, 123 is
"one-twenty-three", never "twelve-three" and only under special
circumstances "one-two-three"...(911 would be one of those special
cases: before "nine-eleven" became a reference to the terrorist attacks
on the WTC, the emergency telephone number was stated this way, but now
it's always "nine-one-one")....

I find Ken Blake's assertion that the Tucson area code of 520 is
pronounced "five-two-oh", because up here in Phoenix we'd be more likely
to say "five-twenty"...certainly my own area code of 480 is always
"four-eighty"....r
Mark Brader
2018-07-09 06:46:33 UTC
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Post by RH Draney
Post by Tony Cooper
There is an East/West tollway in this area that is SR 408. ("SR"
means "state road") The radio traffic reports inform about conditions
on "the four oh eight".
The usual US practice is to break numbers into pairs of digits and state
each pair as if it were a separate number...if an odd number of digits,
the first stands alone and the remainder are paired...
Certainly[1], and the same here.

And the important point that R.H. omitted: if a digit-pair consists of
a zero and then a non-zero digit, it's pronounced as "oh" and the second
digit, as in Tony's example.

[1] Provided that we're talking about a number of up to 4 digits that does
not simply represent a measurement or a count, such as a monetary amount.
--
Mark Brader "Unfortunately for the grass, the cold water is
Toronto moving at over half the speed of sound."
***@vex.net --Randall Munroe

My text in this article is in the public domain.
Peter T. Daniels
2018-07-09 11:35:46 UTC
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Post by RH Draney
Post by Tony Cooper
On Sun, 8 Jul 2018 23:11:16 +0100, Paul Wolff
Post by Paul Wolff
Post by Ken Blake
I live in Tucson, where the area code is 520. Probably the great
majority of Tucsonans say "five-two-oh," but I don't.
I could be wrong (as if!) but hereabouts road numbers with four digits
(that's excluding the initial letter, M, A or B) are said digit by
digit, with "oh" for zero. So the A4074 is "A (voiced) four oh seven
four". With one or two digits, the number is given as a normal number -
the A34 is the "A (voiced) thirty-four". With three digit numbers, I
haven't yet determined a speech pattern (the A four-twenty, the A three
four three, etc).
My phone, the one with a built-in computer complete with web browser,
lets me get driving directions from a voce supplied by Google. It's
inclined to state road numbers by full number where I'd expect a
breakdown - so, in the above three-digit examples, "A four hundred and
twenty" and "A three hundred and forty three".
But I haven't got lab notebooks to prove it. So far, it's an impression
only. Am I alone in this thought? If it's true, maybe it reflects AmE
practice.
There is an East/West tollway in this area that is SR 408. ("SR"
means "state road") The radio traffic reports inform about conditions
on "the four oh eight".
The usual US practice is to break numbers into pairs of digits and state
each pair as if it were a separate number...if an odd number of digits,
the first stands alone and the remainder are paired...thus, 123 is
"one-twenty-three", never "twelve-three" and only under special
circumstances "one-two-three"...(911 would be one of those special
cases: before "nine-eleven" became a reference to the terrorist attacks
on the WTC, the emergency telephone number was stated this way,
Not around here. "Four one one" for Information existed in the 1950s, and
they'd reserved all the -11 "area codes" for that sort of thing. 611 was
repairs, and after 911, we got 311 for city services and 511 for transit
and travel information.
Post by RH Draney
but now
it's always "nine-one-one")....
I find Ken Blake's assertion that the Tucson area code of 520 is
pronounced "five-two-oh", because up here in Phoenix we'd be more likely
to say "five-twenty"...certainly my own area code of 480 is always
"four-eighty"....r
Bizarre.

Has anyone gotten "four-twenty" yet?
RH Draney
2018-07-09 12:22:49 UTC
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Post by Peter T. Daniels
Post by RH Draney
I find Ken Blake's assertion that the Tucson area code of 520 is
pronounced "five-two-oh", because up here in Phoenix we'd be more likely
to say "five-twenty"...certainly my own area code of 480 is always
"four-eighty"....r
Bizarre.
Has anyone gotten "four-twenty" yet?
My sources say "unassigned", but as an international "country code" it
belongs to the Czech Republic....

Incidentally, the rule about breaking long strings into pairs of digits
can also be modified by those who assign the numbers, which is why it's
so annoying to hear someone from another country ("where they do things
funny") try to read a US telephone number...here, the breakdown is
<three-digit-area-code>, <three-digit-exchange>, <four-digit-number>,
which does not break down the same way as a single string of ten digits....

American Express (if I'm permitted to reveal what may once have been a
trade secret) displays its 15-digit account number as 4+6+5, forcing the
pairing of digits to break in a couple of odd places...in fact, the
embedded "geo-district" code (telling AmEx people what country you're
from) consists of the last two digits of the first group and the first
digit of the second....

Changing the sub-subject slightly, has anyone ever had to take down a
long "confirmation number" from an automated voice on the telephone,
where the string contains a number of consecutive zeroes?...after
completing your transaction, you're asked to write down for your records
something like "eight-oh-seven-oh-nine-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-..." (my god,
is she all right?) "...-oh-oh-one-three-six", with absolutely no rhythm,
accent, or structure, and presumably to repeat it back the same way if
you have to call customer service later for any reason (miss out just
one "oh" and they'll tell you the confirmation number is invalid)....r
Ken Blake
2018-07-09 16:28:24 UTC
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Post by RH Draney
Post by Tony Cooper
On Sun, 8 Jul 2018 23:11:16 +0100, Paul Wolff
Post by Paul Wolff
Post by Ken Blake
I live in Tucson, where the area code is 520. Probably the great
majority of Tucsonans say "five-two-oh," but I don't.
I could be wrong (as if!) but hereabouts road numbers with four digits
(that's excluding the initial letter, M, A or B) are said digit by
digit, with "oh" for zero. So the A4074 is "A (voiced) four oh seven
four". With one or two digits, the number is given as a normal number -
the A34 is the "A (voiced) thirty-four". With three digit numbers, I
haven't yet determined a speech pattern (the A four-twenty, the A three
four three, etc).
My phone, the one with a built-in computer complete with web browser,
lets me get driving directions from a voce supplied by Google. It's
inclined to state road numbers by full number where I'd expect a
breakdown - so, in the above three-digit examples, "A four hundred and
twenty" and "A three hundred and forty three".
But I haven't got lab notebooks to prove it. So far, it's an impression
only. Am I alone in this thought? If it's true, maybe it reflects AmE
practice.
There is an East/West tollway in this area that is SR 408. ("SR"
means "state road") The radio traffic reports inform about conditions
on "the four oh eight".
The usual US practice is to break numbers into pairs of digits and state
each pair as if it were a separate number...if an odd number of digits,
the first stands alone and the remainder are paired...thus, 123 is
"one-twenty-three", never "twelve-three" and only under special
circumstances "one-two-three"...(911 would be one of those special
cases: before "nine-eleven" became a reference to the terrorist attacks
on the WTC, the emergency telephone number was stated this way, but now
it's always "nine-one-one")....
I find Ken Blake's assertion that the Tucson area code of 520 is
pronounced "five-two-oh", because up here in Phoenix we'd be more likely
to say "five-twenty"...certainly my own area code of 480 is always
"four-eighty"....r
Interesting. I can't remember ever hearing anyone say "five-twenty" or
"four-eighty."
Lewis
2018-07-09 18:28:52 UTC
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Post by RH Draney
Post by Tony Cooper
On Sun, 8 Jul 2018 23:11:16 +0100, Paul Wolff
Post by Paul Wolff
Post by Ken Blake
I live in Tucson, where the area code is 520. Probably the great
majority of Tucsonans say "five-two-oh," but I don't.
I could be wrong (as if!) but hereabouts road numbers with four digits
(that's excluding the initial letter, M, A or B) are said digit by
digit, with "oh" for zero. So the A4074 is "A (voiced) four oh seven
four". With one or two digits, the number is given as a normal number -
the A34 is the "A (voiced) thirty-four". With three digit numbers, I
haven't yet determined a speech pattern (the A four-twenty, the A three
four three, etc).
My phone, the one with a built-in computer complete with web browser,
lets me get driving directions from a voce supplied by Google. It's
inclined to state road numbers by full number where I'd expect a
breakdown - so, in the above three-digit examples, "A four hundred and
twenty" and "A three hundred and forty three".
But I haven't got lab notebooks to prove it. So far, it's an impression
only. Am I alone in this thought? If it's true, maybe it reflects AmE
practice.
There is an East/West tollway in this area that is SR 408. ("SR"
means "state road") The radio traffic reports inform about conditions
on "the four oh eight".
The usual US practice is to break numbers into pairs of digits and state
each pair as if it were a separate number...if an odd number of digits,
the first stands alone and the remainder are paired...thus, 123 is
"one-twenty-three", never "twelve-three" and only under special
circumstances "one-two-three"
Never "twelve-three" is correct, but as for pairing the digits? No, I
don't agree. There is no universal pattern and in my experience
"one twenty-three" is about as common as "one two three".

The exception is when you have a highway that is 2 digits and then an
auxiliary highway that adds a prefix digit. The Eighty in California has
the eight-eighty, for example. or I-70 in Colordao has "two seventy" as
its auxiliary.

If the middle digit is a zero, then three numbers are always said and
the middle on is nearly always "oh" (The four oh five, the one oh one,
etc.).

I always pair 4 digit numbers in addresses (ten twenty one for 1021, for
example), but I hear plenty of people who say "one oh two one" or
sometimes even "one oh twenty-one"
Post by RH Draney
...(911 would be one of those special cases: before "nine-eleven"
became a reference to the terrorist attacks on the WTC, the emergency
telephone number was stated this way, but now it's always
"nine-one-one")....
Not in my experience, no, it has been "nine one one" since I first
encountered it in 1975.
Post by RH Draney
I find Ken Blake's assertion that the Tucson area code of 520 is
pronounced "five-two-oh", because up here in Phoenix we'd be more likely
to say "five-twenty"...certainly my own area code of 480 is always
"four-eighty"....r
Seven two oh is more common that seven twenty here, but most people
simply write a number as 3/555-1212 or 7/555-1212 to distinguish the
two overlay area codes. However, when I lived in California the area
code was five one oh, and I never heard anyone say five ten and the
area code for Santa Jose/Santa Cruz was universally four oh eight.
--
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TOFU>
Lewis
2018-07-09 18:35:01 UTC
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Post by Lewis
Seven two oh is more common that seven twenty here,
I have no idea where my brain went on its little vacation when I was
typing that; Aruba, perhaps. seven-two-oh is *MUCH* more common than
seven-twenty. So much so that I'm not sure I've heard seven-twenty.
--
Are you a lucky little lady in the city of light Or just another lost
angel?
Jerry Friedman
2018-07-09 22:55:03 UTC
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On Monday, July 9, 2018 at 1:14:35 PM UTC-6, Lewis wrote:
...
Post by Lewis
I always pair 4 digit numbers in addresses (ten twenty one for 1021, for
example), but I hear plenty of people who say "one oh two one" or
sometimes even "one oh twenty-one"
...

If you heard me, you'd hear "one zero two one".
--
Jerry Friedman
John Varela
2018-07-08 23:26:38 UTC
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Post by bill van
Post by Ken Blake
Post by John Varela
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
I always try to pronounce the numeral 0 as "zero." To me "oh" is a
letter, not a number.
So do I, usually. It avoids confusion between the number and the
letter. But there are
exceptions. The main telephone area code for Vancouver is 604, and
absolutely everyone
says it as "six-oh-four".
The area code here is seven-oh-three and the ZIP code is two two one
oh one.

Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
--
John Varela
Mark Brader
2018-07-09 00:39:48 UTC
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Post by John Varela
The area code here is seven-oh-three and the ZIP code is two two one
oh one.
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
--
Mark Brader | "What a strange field. Studying beings instead of mathematics.
Toronto | Could lead to recursive problems in logic."
***@vex.net | -- Robert L. Forward (The Flight of the Dragonfly)
Mack A. Damia
2018-07-09 00:51:57 UTC
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Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
The area code here is seven-oh-three and the ZIP code is two two one
oh one.
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
Both. John is correct.


Peter Young
2018-07-09 06:54:16 UTC
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Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
The area code here is seven-oh-three and the ZIP code is two two one
oh one.
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
It's actually both, I think, according to Glenn Miller, at different parts
of the song.

Peter.
--
Peter Young, (BrE, RP), Consultant Anaesthetist, 1975-2004.
(US equivalent: Certified Anesthesiologist) (AUE Pt)
Cheltenham and Gloucester, UK. Now happily retired.
http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk
CDB
2018-07-09 10:14:26 UTC
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Post by Peter Young
Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
The area code here is seven-oh-three and the ZIP code is two two
one oh one.
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
It's actually both, I think, according to Glenn Miller, at different
parts of the song.

Peter Duncanson [BrE]
2018-07-09 10:47:14 UTC
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Post by CDB
Post by Peter Young
Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
The area code here is seven-oh-three and the ZIP code is two two
one oh one.
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
It's actually both, I think, according to Glenn Miller, at different
parts of the song.
http://youtu.be/AGOUldTrk-A
This has two text versions of the lyrics
https://lyricsplayground.com/alpha/songs/p/pennsylvania65000.html
They both use:
Pennsylvania 6-5000
and
Pensylvania 6-5-0-0-0
--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)
Mark Brader
2018-07-09 19:11:34 UTC
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Post by CDB
Post by Peter Young
Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
It's actually both, I think, according to Glenn Miller, at different
parts of the song.
http://youtu.be/AGOUldTrk-A
I don't do Internet video. Does this source confirm that Peter's right
and I was wrong?
--
Mark Brader "They have computers, and they may have
Toronto other weapons of mass destruction."
***@vex.net -- Janet Reno, 1998
Peter Young
2018-07-09 20:53:54 UTC
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Post by CDB
Post by Peter Young
Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
It's actually both, I think, according to Glenn Miller, at different
parts of the song.
http://youtu.be/AGOUldTrk-A
I don't do Internet video. >
I don't normally, but ...
Does this source confirm that Peter's right and I was wrong?
... this source doesn't go far enough, being only the first chorus. My
recollection is that the last appearance of the phrase is that it's "six
five thousand". It's too hot here and I'm too tired to look further, but
I'm prepared to be proved wrong. "Old men forget".

Peter.
--
Peter Young, (BrE, RP), Consultant Anaesthetist, 1975-2004.
(US equivalent: Certified Anesthesiologist) (AUE Pt)
Cheltenham and Gloucester, UK. Now happily retired.
http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk
Jerry Friedman
2018-07-09 23:03:46 UTC
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Post by Peter Young
Post by Peter Young
Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
It's actually both, I think, according to Glenn Miller, at different
parts of the song.
I don't do Internet video. >
I don't normally, but ...
Does this source confirm that Peter's right and I was wrong?
... this source doesn't go far enough, being only the first chorus. My
recollection is that the last appearance of the phrase is that it's "six
five thousand". It's too hot here and I'm too tired to look further, but
I'm prepared to be proved wrong. "Old men forget".
Your recollection is correct, according to



CDB's link started at 2:14, so it probably included only the last
repetition of the phone number. But it won't play for me.
--
Jerry Friedman
CDB
2018-07-10 11:40:57 UTC
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Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Peter Young
Post by Peter Young
Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
It's actually both, I think, according to Glenn Miller, at
different parts of the song.
C.D. Bellemare:

................

Mark Brader:
I don't do Internet video.

I can see that. In a sense.
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Peter Young
I don't normally, but ...
Does this source confirm that Peter's right and I was wrong?
... this source doesn't go far enough, being only the first chorus.
My recollection is that the last appearance of the phrase is that
it's "six five thousand". It's too hot here and I'm too tired to
look further, but I'm prepared to be proved wrong. "Old men
forget".
Your recollection is correct, according to
http://youtu.be/acsnJYqRqA0
CDB's link started at 2:14, so it probably included only the last
repetition of the phone number. But it won't play for me.
Mysterious ways. I have tried it, and it works for me.
CDB
2018-07-10 11:40:50 UTC
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Post by Peter Young
Post by CDB
Post by Peter Young
Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
It's actually both, I think, according to Glenn Miller, at
different parts of the song.
http://youtu.be/AGOUldTrk-A
I don't do Internet video. >
I don't normally, but ...
Does this source confirm that Peter's right and I was wrong?
... this source doesn't go far enough, being only the first chorus.
My recollection is that the last appearance of the phrase is that
it's "six five thousand". It's too hot here and I'm too tired to look
further, but I'm prepared to be proved wrong. "Old men forget".
If that 's my link you mean, the chorus comes at 2:14 of the recording.
I didn't check to see if there are any more lyrics, but I suspect not.
CDB
2018-07-10 11:40:38 UTC
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Post by Mark Brader
Post by CDB
Post by Peter Young
Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
It's actually both, I think, according to Glenn Miller, at
different parts of the song.
http://youtu.be/AGOUldTrk-A
I don't do Internet video. Does this source confirm that Peter's
right and I was wrong?
It confirms that "six five oh-oh-oh" is used at least once during the
performance.
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2018-07-10 12:55:43 UTC
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Post by CDB
Post by Mark Brader
Post by CDB
Post by Peter Young
Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
It's actually both, I think, according to Glenn Miller, at
different parts of the song.
http://youtu.be/AGOUldTrk-A
I don't do Internet video. Does this source confirm that Peter's
right and I was wrong?
It confirms that "six five oh-oh-oh" is used at least once during the
performance.
It gets complicated with a long sequence of repeated digits. The number
I need to dial to open the barrier to our residence is 07000000626787.
(I'm not giving away any secret information: it only works if it
recognizes the telephone sending the command.)
--
athel
John Varela
2018-07-10 00:12:04 UTC
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Post by Peter Young
Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
The area code here is seven-oh-three and the ZIP code is two two one
oh one.
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
It's actually both, I think, according to Glenn Miller, at different parts
of the song.
The official lyric is Pennsylvania six-five thousand, but in the
final chorus the Glenn Miller band shouts "Pensylvania
six-five-oh-oh-oh". Not nil, zero, naught, or aught; they say "oh".
--
John Varela
Mark Brader
2018-07-10 06:19:27 UTC
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Post by John Varela
The official lyric is Pennsylvania six-five thousand, but in the
final chorus the Glenn Miller band shouts "Pensylvania
six-five-oh-oh-oh".
Thanks to you and Jerry for clearing up my misconception.

I stayed there once, by the way, probably early in the new century.
--
Mark Brader "Exercise 5-3: ... When should you
Toronto have stopped adding features...?"
***@vex.net -- Kernighan & Pike
Mack A. Damia
2018-07-10 14:27:36 UTC
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Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
The official lyric is Pennsylvania six-five thousand, but in the
final chorus the Glenn Miller band shouts "Pensylvania
six-five-oh-oh-oh".
Thanks to you and Jerry for clearing up my misconception.
The truth is often elusive, eh?
Post by Mark Brader
I stayed there once, by the way, probably early in the new century.
Methinks you can't find the exit.
Peter Young
2018-07-10 06:24:26 UTC
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Post by John Varela
Post by Peter Young
Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
The area code here is seven-oh-three and the ZIP code is two two one
oh one.
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
It's actually both, I think, according to Glenn Miller, at different parts
of the song.
The official lyric is Pennsylvania six-five thousand, but in the
final chorus the Glenn Miller band shouts "Pensylvania
six-five-oh-oh-oh". Not nil, zero, naught, or aught; they say "oh".
Thank-you.

Peter.
--
Peter Young, (BrE, RP), Consultant Anaesthetist, 1975-2004.
(US equivalent: Certified Anesthesiologist) (AUE Pt)
Cheltenham and Gloucester, UK. Now happily retired.
http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk
Snidely
2018-07-10 16:44:34 UTC
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Post by John Varela
Post by Peter Young
Post by Mark Brader
Post by John Varela
The area code here is seven-oh-three and the ZIP code is two two one
oh one.
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
You did. It's "six - five thousand".
It's actually both, I think, according to Glenn Miller, at different parts
of the song.
The official lyric is Pennsylvania six-five thousand, but in the
final chorus the Glenn Miller band shouts "Pensylvania
six-five-oh-oh-oh". Not nil, zero, naught, or aught; they say "oh".
At 1:24 of Jerry's link, someone shouts "five thousand" (per my ears)
-- but not the whole phone number. 2:34-ish is the oh-digits.

CDB's link gives me "video is unavailable".

/dps
--
Killing a mouse was hardly a Nobel Prize-worthy exercise, and Lawrence
went apopleptic when he learned a lousy rodent had peed away all his
precious heavy water.
_The Disappearing Spoon_, Sam Kean
Peter T. Daniels
2018-07-09 04:11:37 UTC
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Post by John Varela
The area code here is seven-oh-three and the ZIP code is two two one
oh one.
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
According to the song, it was PEnnsylvania six, five thousand.
Snidely
2018-07-10 16:02:17 UTC
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Post by John Varela
Post by bill van
Post by Ken Blake
Post by John Varela
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
I always try to pronounce the numeral 0 as "zero." To me "oh" is a
letter, not a number.
So do I, usually. It avoids confusion between the number and the
letter. But there are
exceptions. The main telephone area code for Vancouver is 604, and
absolutely everyone
says it as "six-oh-four".
The area code here is seven-oh-three and the ZIP code is two two one
oh one.
There are too many area codes here, and 5 minute's drive gets you into
a different zip code (ignoring Plus-4), unless you head out to Thousand
Oaks (where zip codes change in a 10 minute drive) or
Lancaster/Palmdale (where 5 minutes drive gets you out of sight of
neighbors).

/dps
Post by John Varela
Don't forget PEnnsylvania six five oh oh oh.
--
Rule #0: Don't be on fire.
In case of fire, exit the building before tweeting about it.
(Sighting reported by Adam F)
Peter T. Daniels
2018-07-10 16:29:53 UTC
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Post by Snidely
There are too many area codes here, and 5 minute's drive gets you into
a different zip code (ignoring Plus-4), unless you head out to Thousand
Oaks (where zip codes change in a 10 minute drive) or
Lancaster/Palmdale (where 5 minutes drive gets you out of sight of
neighbors).
Well, you've chosen to live in a very densely populated place. Both codes,
area and ZIP (it's an acronym), are assigned by population.
Lewis
2018-07-08 23:59:19 UTC
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Post by bill van
Post by Ken Blake
Post by John Varela
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup
scores with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
So how do you say it in American? Oh, wait, I see you gave a reference.
It wasn't one, really.
Post by Peter Moylan
A score of "one-zero" sounds vaguely wrong to me. You could go for
"one-love", I suppose.
Then you'd sound like you escaped from the tennis world. The standard
pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
I always try to pronounce the numeral 0 as "zero." To me "oh" is a
letter, not a number.
So do I, usually. It avoids confusion between the number and the
letter. But there are
exceptions. The main telephone area code for Vancouver is 604, and
absolutely everyone
says it as "six-oh-four".
Denver's area codes are 303 and 720, universally three-oh-three and
seven-two-zero.
--
Mos Eisley spaceport. You will never find a more wretched hive of scum
and villainy. We must be cautious.
Mark Brader
2018-07-08 22:08:52 UTC
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Post by Ken Blake
Post by John Varela
The standard pronunciation of a 1-0 score over here is "one (to) nothing".
I would be most likely to say "one-oh".
I don't think I've ever heard that. (I have heard "one-zip", which
someone else mentioned, but I consider it nonstandard, perhaps a sort
of of emphasis.)

However, when 1-0 is not a score but is a win-loss record, i.e. it
means one win and no losses, then it's pronounced "one and oh".
Post by Ken Blake
I always try to pronounce the numeral 0 as "zero." To me "oh" is a
letter, not a number.
That's a good habit in situations where either one might occur, but
unnecessary verbosity otherwise, I'd say.
--
Mark Brader | Peter Neumann on Y2K:
Toronto | This problem gives new meaning to "going out on
***@vex.net | a date" (which many systems will do on 1/1/00).

My text in this article is in the public domain.
Peter Duncanson [BrE]
2018-07-04 10:26:38 UTC
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On Tue, 3 Jul 2018 16:24:42 -0600, Jerry Friedman
Post by Jerry Friedman
Okay, what's going on with "this" and "are"?
"And this England are so young, and they've played thus far with such
kind of optimism, with verve and joy."
Roger Bennett, who has an English accent, in an interview on U.S.
National Public Radio on June 29.
https://www.npr.org/2018/06/29/624789715/remaining-teams-move-on-to-knockout-stage-of-world-cup
To be understood as "And (the members of) this England (team) are so
young,..."
--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)
Jerry Friedman
2018-07-04 13:18:50 UTC
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Post by Peter Duncanson [BrE]
On Tue, 3 Jul 2018 16:24:42 -0600, Jerry Friedman
Post by Jerry Friedman
Okay, what's going on with "this" and "are"?
"And this England are so young, and they've played thus far with such
kind of optimism, with verve and joy."
Roger Bennett, who has an English accent, in an interview on U.S.
National Public Radio on June 29.
https://www.npr.org/2018/06/29/624789715/remaining-teams-move-on-to-knockout-stage-of-world-cup
To be understood as "And (the members of) this England (team) are so
young,..."
Thanks.
--
Jerry Friedman
Quinn C
2018-07-04 21:37:14 UTC
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Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup scores
with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
https://www.npr.org/2018/06/18/620939115/reaction-to-mexicos-soccer-goal-moved-the-earth-literally
Isn't the most common format for soccer results also "Mexico 1 -
Germany nil"? [1] Another thing to get used to, besides "zero" having
a different name in almost each sport.
____
[1] I understand that the "beat" in the above makes it different.
--
The trouble some people have being German, I thought,
I have being human.
-- Margaret Atwood, Surfacing (novel), p.130
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-07-04 23:03:14 UTC
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Post by Quinn C
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup scores
with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
https://www.npr.org/2018/06/18/620939115/reaction-to-mexicos-soccer-goal-moved-the-earth-literally
Isn't the most common format for soccer results also "Mexico 1 -
Germany nil"? [1] Another thing to get used to, besides "zero" having
a different name in almost each sport.
____
[1] I understand that the "beat" in the above makes it different.
Only in spoken announcements of a list of results. The written format is
more usually

Mexico 1-0 Germany

What is different is that home teams come first. It's A v B where A is
at home rather than the B @ A format in US fixtures.
Peter T. Daniels
2018-07-05 02:19:06 UTC
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Post by Madrigal Gurneyhalt
Post by Quinn C
Isn't the most common format for soccer results also "Mexico 1 -
Germany nil"? [1] Another thing to get used to, besides "zero" having
a different name in almost each sport.
____
[1] I understand that the "beat" in the above makes it different.
Only in spoken announcements of a list of results. The written format is
more usually
Mexico 1-0 Germany
What is different is that home teams come first. It's A v B where A is
In baseball, the home team bats in the second half of the inning, so it's
not only polite, it's logical to list the visitors first.
Quinn C
2018-07-05 17:47:00 UTC
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Post by Madrigal Gurneyhalt
Post by Quinn C
Post by Jerry Friedman
And while I'm at it, I've heard NPR announcers mention World Cup scores
with "nil". E.g., "Mexico beat Germany 1-nil."
https://www.npr.org/2018/06/18/620939115/reaction-to-mexicos-soccer-goal-moved-the-earth-literally
Isn't the most common format for soccer results also "Mexico 1 -
Germany nil"? [1] Another thing to get used to, besides "zero" having
a different name in almost each sport.
____
[1] I understand that the "beat" in the above makes it different.
Only in spoken announcements of a list of results. The written format is
more usually
Mexico 1-0 Germany
What is different is that home teams come first. It's A v B where A is
Home team first is the same in German, but the usual format is:

Mexiko -- Deutschland 1:0

And that's the order in which it's spoken as well. The : becomes "zu".
--
Bill Gates working as a waiter:
- Waiter, there's a fly in my soup
- Try again, maybe it won't be there this time
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-07-03 16:32:06 UTC
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Post by Harrison Hill
Americans are often perplexed by us Brits using "The police were" vs
"There was three kings into the east..."?
I've had this in my vocabulary since I was a teenager - from a Folk
<https://www.davidpbrown.co.uk/poetry/robert-burns.html>
It's not Burns. It's a barely disguised piece of plagiarism.
Harrison Hill
2018-07-03 16:47:50 UTC
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Post by Madrigal Gurneyhalt
Post by Harrison Hill
Americans are often perplexed by us Brits using "The police were" vs
"There was three kings into the east..."?
I've had this in my vocabulary since I was a teenager - from a Folk
<https://www.davidpbrown.co.uk/poetry/robert-burns.html>
It's not Burns. It's a barely disguised piece of plagiarism.
And variously "into the east" and "unto the east"; but either
way "towards the east"?

"AS it is well known that the ‘wise men’ came ‘from the East,’ and
as Mr. Touch-and-go Bullet-head came from the East, it follows that
Mr. Bullet-head was a wise man".

<https://classic-literature.co.uk/x-ing-a-paragraph/>
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