Discussion:
Quick and the Dead
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b***@gmail.com
2018-01-10 18:56:00 UTC
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What's it mean and what's its origin — and is that a better term than etymology?
the Omrud
2018-01-10 19:03:40 UTC
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Post by b***@gmail.com
What's it mean and what's its origin — and is that a better term than etymology?
It's from the bible.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_quick_and_the_dead_(idiom)

"Quick" is an old word meaning "alive2.
--
David
Peter Duncanson [BrE]
2018-01-10 20:47:15 UTC
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Post by b***@gmail.com
What's it mean and what's its origin — and is that a better term than etymology?
It's from the bible.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_quick_and_the_dead_(idiom)
"Quick" is an old word meaning "alive2.
Yes. The characteristic of a living thing is that it can move in some
way.

Over the centuries the meaning of "quick" has developed from "alive" to
"moving rapidly", physically or mentally, and then to "rapid/fast/etc".
--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)
Madrigal Gurneyhalt
2018-01-10 21:19:17 UTC
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Post by b***@gmail.com
What's it mean and what's its origin — and is that a better term than etymology?
It's from the bible.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_quick_and_the_dead_(idiom)
"Quick" is an old word meaning "alive2.
Yes. The characteristic of a living thing is that it can move in some
way.
Over the centuries the meaning of "quick" has developed from "alive" to
"moving rapidly", physically or mentally, and then to "rapid/fast/etc".
That's a pleasing looking 'evolution' but it really isn't realistic. OED has
citations for 'quick' in the sense of mental acuity from the 13th Century
and physically speedy from the very beginning of the 14th. The word's
inherent extensibility seems to be almost as old as the word itself.
Ross
2018-01-11 04:07:12 UTC
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Post by Madrigal Gurneyhalt
Post by Peter Duncanson [BrE]
Post by the Omrud
Post by b***@gmail.com
What's it mean and what's its origin — and is that a better term than etymology?
It's from the bible.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_quick_and_the_dead_(idiom)
"Quick" is an old word meaning "alive2.
Yes. The characteristic of a living thing is that it can move in some
way.
Over the centuries the meaning of "quick" has developed from "alive" to
"moving rapidly", physically or mentally, and then to "rapid/fast/etc".
That's a pleasing looking 'evolution' but it really isn't realistic. OED has
citations for 'quick' in the sense of mental acuity from the 13th Century
and physically speedy from the very beginning of the 14th. The word's
inherent extensibility seems to be almost as old as the word itself.
In what sense is it not realistic? All you seem to be saying is that
the semantic extension begins earlier than you might think -- and
might not even have taken many centuries to emerge. Probably true.
From "alive" to "lively" (if not all the way to "speedy") might be
a very well-worn semantic pathway. Certainly we can see derivatives
from the same root (PIE *gwei-) in different branches moving in the
same direction: Greek biōtikós 'fit for life, lively', Latin vīvidus
'living, animated, lively', Russian zhivoj 'living; vivid, brisk, animated'.
Has English alone extended it to "rapid"?
Looking at the closer cognates: Dutch kwiek 'spry', German keck 'bold',
but Swedish kvick 'quick, rapid, swift'... Is this an English borrowing,
or could the "swift" sense in English be due to Norse influence?
Janet
2018-01-12 01:54:12 UTC
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Post by Peter Duncanson [BrE]
Post by the Omrud
What's it mean and what's its origin ? and is that a better term than etymology?
It's from the bible.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_quick_and_the_dead_(idiom)
"Quick" is an old word meaning "alive2.
Yes. The characteristic of a living thing is that it can move in some
way.
Over the centuries the meaning of "quick" has developed from "alive" to
"moving rapidly", physically or mentally, and then to "rapid/fast/etc".
"Quickening" in pregnancy, is when the mother first feels movement from
the foetus.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quickening

"The word "quick" originally meant "alive". Historically, quickening
has sometimes been considered to be the beginning of the possession of
"individual life" by the fetus. British legal scholar William Blackstone
explained the subject of quickening in the eighteenth century,...."

Janet
Ken Blake
2018-01-12 18:57:14 UTC
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Post by Peter Duncanson [BrE]
Post by the Omrud
What's it mean and what's its origin ? and is that a better term than etymology?
It's from the bible.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_quick_and_the_dead_(idiom)
"Quick" is an old word meaning "alive2.
Yes. The characteristic of a living thing is that it can move in some
way.
Over the centuries the meaning of "quick" has developed from "alive" to
"moving rapidly", physically or mentally, and then to "rapid/fast/etc".
"Quickening" in pregnancy, is when the mother first feels movement from
the foetus.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quickening
"The word "quick" originally meant "alive". Historically, quickening
has sometimes been considered to be the beginning of the possession of
"individual life" by the fetus. British legal scholar William Blackstone
explained the subject of quickening in the eighteenth century,...."
Hor

Dingbat
2018-01-11 03:02:07 UTC
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Post by the Omrud
Post by b***@gmail.com
What's it mean and what's its origin — and is that a better term than etymology?
It's from the bible.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_quick_and_the_dead_(idiom)
"Quick" is an old word meaning "alive2.
Tyndale's English, like Indian English, seems to use the definite article
sparingly: <<... Christ which shall iudge quicke and deed ... - 2 Tim 4:1>>

When did using "the" as much as it's used now become de rigeur?
Harrison Hill
2018-01-10 19:13:29 UTC
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What's it mean and what's its origin — and is that a better term than etymology?
"Quick" means "alive" and so is the opposite of "dead".

The "quick" is the sensitive skin around my fingernails. If
you have ever handled "quick-silver", you'll know that it seems
to be "alive", as well as merely fast moving.

"A spur that pricked to the quick".

Thomas North’s A Translation of Plutarch (1535-1601)

<https://forum.wordreference.com/threads/a-spur-that-pricked-to-the-quick-thomas-north.2648896/>
Dingbat
2018-01-11 03:04:05 UTC
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Post by Harrison Hill
Post by b***@gmail.com
What's it mean and what's its origin — and is that a better term than etymology?
"Quick" means "alive" and so is the opposite of "dead".
The "quick" is the sensitive skin around my fingernails. If
you have ever handled "quick-silver", you'll know that it seems
to be "alive", as well as merely fast moving.
"A spur that pricked to the quick".
Thomas North’s A Translation of Plutarch (1535-1601)
<https://forum.wordreference.com/threads/a-spur-that-pricked-to-the-quick-thomas-north.2648896/>
Cut to the quick | Dictionary.com
http://www.dictionary.com/browse/cut--to--the--quick
Jerry Friedman
2018-01-10 19:46:26 UTC
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Post by b***@gmail.com
What's it mean
Those are the two classes of pedestrians.
Post by b***@gmail.com
and what's its origin — and is that a better term than etymology?
Probably, if you want to know where the phrase comes from and why it
means what it means, not the history of the words in Old English
and maybe Proto-Germanic and Proto-Indo-European.
--
Jerry Friedman
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