Discussion:
Why on earth do we abbreviate "alli" so often (to save 1 character)?
(too old to reply)
arlen holder
2019-01-17 21:41:45 UTC
Permalink
Is "alli" really that hard to spell out?

Why is "et al." so prevalent when "et alli" is only a single additional item?

REFERENCE:
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/s2JlY76bDwAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/1Q68XwvHDwAJ>
Peter Young
2019-01-17 22:15:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by arlen holder
Is "alli" really that hard to spell out?
Why is "et al." so prevalent when "et alli" is only a single additional item?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/s2JlY76bDwAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/1Q68XwvHDwAJ>
What? What is "et alli" anyway? Do you mean "et alia"? The GG post that
you reference is incorrect and ignorant in using "et alli".

Peter.
--
Peter Young, (BrE, RP), Consultant Anaesthetist, 1975-2004.
(US equivalent: Certified Anesthesiologist) (AUE Au)
Cheltenham and Gloucester, UK. Now happily retired.
http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk
CDB
2019-01-18 14:45:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Young
Post by arlen holder
Is "alli" really that hard to spell out?
Why is "et al." so prevalent when "et alli" is only a single
additional item?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/s2JlY76bDwAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/1Q68XwvHDwAJ>
Post by Peter Young
What? What is "et alli" anyway? Do you mean "et alia"? The GG post
that you reference is incorrect and ignorant in using "et alli".
I agree that it could stand for "and other things" in the form "et
alia", but IME "et al" is usually used for "and other people", while
things are covered by "et cetera".

It was usually an abbreviation of "et alii", but nowadays that could
easily be "et aliae", so cutting off the gendered endings makes sense,
unless you want to specify.

Hi, Algeria.
b***@aol.com
2019-01-18 17:26:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by arlen holder
Post by Peter Young
Post by arlen holder
Is "alli" really that hard to spell out?
Why is "et al." so prevalent when "et alli" is only a single additional item?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/s2JlY76bDwAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/1Q68XwvHDwAJ>
Post by Peter Young
What? What is "et alli" anyway? Do you mean "et alia"? The GG post
that you reference is incorrect and ignorant in using "et alli".
I agree that it could stand for "and other things" in the form "et
alia", but IME "et al" is usually used for "and other people", while
things are covered by "et cetera".
It was usually an abbreviation of "et alii",
As in in "ariki, arii et alii"?
Post by arlen holder
but nowadays that could
easily be "et aliae", so cutting off the gendered endings makes sense,
unless you want to specify.
Hi, Algeria.
CDB
2019-01-18 21:03:35 UTC
Permalink
[et al]
Post by b***@aol.com
Post by CDB
It was usually an abbreviation of "et alii",
As in in "ariki, arii et alii"?
¿Quién sabe, haole?

[peekaboo]
Horace LaBadie
2019-01-18 21:06:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by CDB
[et al]
Post by b***@aol.com
Post by CDB
It was usually an abbreviation of "et alii",
As in in "ariki, arii et alii"?
¿Quién sabe, haole?
[peekaboo]
Aloha oe !
Adam Funk
2019-01-22 11:57:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by arlen holder
Post by Peter Young
Post by arlen holder
Is "alli" really that hard to spell out?
Why is "et al." so prevalent when "et alli" is only a single
additional item?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/s2JlY76bDwAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/1Q68XwvHDwAJ>
Post by Peter Young
What? What is "et alli" anyway? Do you mean "et alia"? The GG post
that you reference is incorrect and ignorant in using "et alli".
I agree that it could stand for "and other things" in the form "et
alia", but IME "et al" is usually used for "and other people", while
things are covered by "et cetera".
What's the semantic difference in Latin between "alia" & "cetera"?
Post by arlen holder
It was usually an abbreviation of "et alii", but nowadays that could
easily be "et aliae", so cutting off the gendered endings makes sense,
unless you want to specify.
Hi, Algeria.
--
One sometimes gets the impression that the mere words 'Socialism' and
'Communism' draw towards them with magnetic force every fruit-juice
drinker, nudist, sandal-wearer, sex-maniac, Quaker, 'Nature Cure'
quack, pacifist, and feminist in England. ---George Orwell
charles
2019-01-22 12:09:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Adam Funk
Post by arlen holder
Post by Peter Young
Post by arlen holder
Is "alli" really that hard to spell out?
Why is "et al." so prevalent when "et alli" is only a single additional item?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/s2JlY76bDwAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/1Q68XwvHDwAJ>
Post by Peter Young
What? What is "et alli" anyway? Do you mean "et alia"? The GG post
that you reference is incorrect and ignorant in using "et alli".
I agree that it could stand for "and other things" in the form "et
alia", but IME "et al" is usually used for "and other people", while
things are covered by "et cetera".
What's the semantic difference in Latin between "alia" & "cetera"?
my Latin dictionary says 'alius' ='in general'; 'cetera' = the other things
--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle
CDB
2019-01-22 14:19:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Adam Funk
Post by CDB
Post by arlen holder
Is "alli" really that hard to spell out?
Why is "et al." so prevalent when "et alli" is only a single additional item?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/s2JlY76bDwAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/1Q68XwvHDwAJ>
What? What is "et alli" anyway? Do you mean "et alia"? The GG
Post by Adam Funk
Post by CDB
post that you reference is incorrect and ignorant in using "et
alli".
I agree that it could stand for "and other things" in the form "et
alia", but IME "et al" is usually used for "and other people",
while things are covered by "et cetera".
What's the semantic difference in Latin between "alia" & "cetera"?
"Other things" versus "the rest". I think the distinction ("al" for
people, "c" for things) is a conventional one, not necessarily based
only on semantics.

http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.04.0060%3Aentry%3Dalius

<http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.04.0060%3Aentry%3Dceterus>

I see from the definition of "alius" that the word is defective, being
replaced in some cases by forms of "alterius". That's another reason
for shortening it to "al".
Post by Adam Funk
Post by CDB
It was usually an abbreviation of "et alii", but nowadays that
could easily be "et aliae", so cutting off the gendered endings
makes sense, unless you want to specify.
Hi, Algeria.
Adam Funk
2019-01-22 20:04:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by arlen holder
Post by Adam Funk
Post by CDB
Post by arlen holder
Is "alli" really that hard to spell out?
Why is "et al." so prevalent when "et alli" is only a single additional item?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/s2JlY76bDwAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/1Q68XwvHDwAJ>
What? What is "et alli" anyway? Do you mean "et alia"? The GG
Post by Adam Funk
Post by CDB
post that you reference is incorrect and ignorant in using "et
alli".
I agree that it could stand for "and other things" in the form "et
alia", but IME "et al" is usually used for "and other people",
while things are covered by "et cetera".
What's the semantic difference in Latin between "alia" & "cetera"?
"Other things" versus "the rest". I think the distinction ("al" for
Interesting, thanks.
Post by arlen holder
people, "c" for things) is a conventional one, not necessarily based
only on semantics.
Yes.
Post by arlen holder
http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.04.0060%3Aentry%3Dalius
<http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.04.0060%3Aentry%3Dceterus>
I see from the definition of "alius" that the word is defective, being
replaced in some cases by forms of "alterius". That's another reason
for shortening it to "al".
Post by Adam Funk
Post by CDB
It was usually an abbreviation of "et alii", but nowadays that
could easily be "et aliae", so cutting off the gendered endings
makes sense, unless you want to specify.
Hi, Algeria.
--
I heard that Hans Christian Andersen lifted the title for "The Little
Mermaid" off a Red Lobster Menu. ---Bucky Katt
Peter Duncanson [BrE]
2019-01-17 22:27:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by arlen holder
Is "alli" really that hard to spell out?
Why is "et al." so prevalent when "et alli" is only a single additional item?
Because "al." in "et al." is the abbreviation of three different
spellings depending on circumstances.
From the Oxford English Dictionary:

Etymology: Abbreviation of Latin et alii (masculine), et aliae
(feminine) or et alia (neuter), ‘and others’.

And others.
Post by arlen holder
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/s2JlY76bDwAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/1Q68XwvHDwAJ>
--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)
arlen holder
2019-01-19 17:53:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Duncanson [BrE]
Because "al." in "et al." is the abbreviation of three different
spellings depending on circumstances.
That makes the most sense!
Thanks!
Joy Beeson
2019-01-18 20:55:24 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 17 Jan 2019 21:41:45 -0000 (UTC), arlen holder
Post by arlen holder
Is "alli" really that hard to spell out?
Why is "et al." so prevalent when "et alli" is only a single additional item?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/s2JlY76bDwAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/1Q68XwvHDwAJ>
Because everybody knows what "et al." means and only the guys over at
alt.language.latin have a clue as to what "et alii" means.
--
Joy Beeson, U.S.A., mostly central Hoosier,
some Northern Indiana, Upstate New York, Florida, and Hawaii
joy beeson at comcast dot net http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/
The above message is a Usenet post.
I don't recall having given anyone permission to use it on a Web site.
Garrett Wollman
2019-01-18 21:35:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Joy Beeson
Because everybody knows what "et al." means and only the guys over at
alt.language.latin have a clue as to what "et alii" means.
Also, these were *handwritten* abbreviations. Their utility was not
measured in "characters". See also "it's".

-GAWollman
--
Garrett A. Wollman | "Act to avoid constraining the future; if you can,
***@bimajority.org| act to remove constraint from the future. This is
Opinions not shared by| a thing you can do, are able to do, to do together."
my employers. | - Graydon Saunders, _A Succession of Bad Days_ (2015)
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2019-01-19 07:37:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Joy Beeson
On Thu, 17 Jan 2019 21:41:45 -0000 (UTC), arlen holder
Post by arlen holder
Is "alli" really that hard to spell out?
Why is "et al." so prevalent when "et alli" is only a single additional item?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/s2JlY76bDwAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/1Q68XwvHDwAJ>
Because everybody knows what "et al." means and only the guys over at
alt.language.latin have a clue as to what "et alii" means.
Exactly.
--
athel
RHDraney
2019-01-19 07:45:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Joy Beeson
On Thu, 17 Jan 2019 21:41:45 -0000 (UTC), arlen holder
Post by arlen holder
Is "alli" really that hard to spell out?
Why is "et al." so prevalent when "et alli" is only a single
additional item?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/s2JlY76bDwAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/1Q68XwvHDwAJ>
Because everybody knows what "et al." means and only the guys over at
alt.language.latin have a clue as to what "et alii" means.
Exactly.
Something to do with garlic, innit?...r
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2019-01-19 07:55:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by RHDraney
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Joy Beeson
On Thu, 17 Jan 2019 21:41:45 -0000 (UTC), arlen holder
Post by arlen holder
Is "alli" really that hard to spell out?
Why is "et al." so prevalent when "et alli" is only a single additional item?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/s2JlY76bDwAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/1Q68XwvHDwAJ>
Because everybody knows what "et al." means and only the guys over at
alt.language.latin have a clue as to what "et alii" means.
Exactly.
Something to do with garlic, innit?...r
I ate a clove of allium last night. I wasn't keen, but my wife said it
tasted good. I won't go so far as to say she was right, but it was OK.
--
athel
Kerr-Mudd,John
2019-01-19 09:47:04 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 19 Jan 2019 07:55:47 GMT, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by RHDraney
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Joy Beeson
On Thu, 17 Jan 2019 21:41:45 -0000 (UTC), arlen holder
Post by arlen holder
Is "alli" really that hard to spell out?
Why is "et al." so prevalent when "et alli" is only a single additional item?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/s2JlY76bD
wAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.os.linux/ydQ9sG-8Y08/1Q68XwvHD
wAJ>
Because everybody knows what "et al." means and only the guys over
at alt.language.latin have a clue as to what "et alii" means.
Exactly.
Something to do with garlic, innit?...r
I ate a clove of allium last night. I wasn't keen, but my wife said it
tasted good. I won't go so far as to say she was right, but it was OK.
Pshurely in the US it'd be spelt "allum"?


You can call me Betty.
--
Bah, and indeed, Humbug.
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