Discussion:
British pronunciation of "Gerard"
(too old to reply)
Jerry Friedman
2019-05-30 15:24:09 UTC
Permalink
I'm reading /Proof/, by Dick Francis. A character introduces himself:
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard soft,
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."

I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J. Is that not how it's normally
pronounced in Britain? If it's not, how is it pronounced? Maybe as in
Gérard or as in Gerhardt?
--
Gerald, not Gerard, Friedman
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2019-05-30 16:08:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jerry Friedman
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard soft,
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J.
I pronounce it exactly like that, neither French nor German. Gerald likewise.
Post by Jerry Friedman
Is that not how it's normally pronounced in Britain? If it's not,
how is it pronounced? Maybe as in Gérard or as in Gerhardt?
--
athel
HVS
2019-05-30 16:18:29 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 30 May 2019 18:08:13 +0200, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard soft,
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J.
I pronounce it exactly like that, neither French nor German. Gerald likewise.
Same here - but with first- or second-syllable stress?

(Second for me, but I think it's widely pronounced with
first-syllable stress in the UK - like "Maurice".)
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2019-05-30 16:35:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by HVS
On Thu, 30 May 2019 18:08:13 +0200, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
I'm reading /Proof/, by Dick Francis. A character introduces
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard
soft,
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J.
I pronounce it exactly like that, neither French nor German. Gerald
likewise.
Same here - but with first- or second-syllable stress?
First, I suppose, but both are fully enunciated -- no schwa in Gerard,
though I have one in Gerald.
Post by HVS
(Second for me, but I think it's widely pronounced with first-syllable
stress in the UK - like "Maurice".)
--
athel
David Kleinecke
2019-05-30 21:01:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by HVS
On Thu, 30 May 2019 18:08:13 +0200, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
I'm reading /Proof/, by Dick Francis. A character introduces
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard
soft,
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J.
I pronounce it exactly like that, neither French nor German. Gerald
likewise.
Same here - but with first- or second-syllable stress?
First, I suppose, but both are fully enunciated -- no schwa in Gerard,
though I have one in Gerald.
I think I say /jrld/ - it seems to rhyme with "world" - but
if I slow down, a vowel surfaces - /jerld/. /wrld/, however,
does not really insert a vowel but one can put a schwa in
if one insists /W^rld/ -sounds the same to me.
s***@gmail.com
2019-05-30 21:59:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by HVS
On Thu, 30 May 2019 18:08:13 +0200, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
I'm reading /Proof/, by Dick Francis. A character introduces
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard
soft,
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J.
I pronounce it exactly like that, neither French nor German. Gerald
likewise.
Same here - but with first- or second-syllable stress?
(Second for me, but I think it's widely pronounced with
first-syllable stress in the UK - like "Maurice".)
For me, jur RARD (it matches my YARD, /dZur jArd/)
but JAIR old ( the second syllable is actually between palled and dolled (up),
so /jeIr Old/) (is EI correct? Evan's list has "rarity" in an example,
but it's for the consonant, not the vowel.)
(and /ld/ is almost the second syllable, when I reduce the vowel)

/dps
David Kleinecke
2019-05-30 22:28:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by s***@gmail.com
Post by HVS
On Thu, 30 May 2019 18:08:13 +0200, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
I'm reading /Proof/, by Dick Francis. A character introduces
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard
soft,
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J.
I pronounce it exactly like that, neither French nor German. Gerald
likewise.
Same here - but with first- or second-syllable stress?
(Second for me, but I think it's widely pronounced with
first-syllable stress in the UK - like "Maurice".)
For me, jur RARD (it matches my YARD, /dZur jArd/)
but JAIR old ( the second syllable is actually between palled and dolled (up),
so /jeIr Old/) (is EI correct? Evan's list has "rarity" in an example,
but it's for the consonant, not the vowel.)
(and /ld/ is almost the second syllable, when I reduce the vowel)
For me /j^.rard/ which I think is the same.
Jerry Friedman
2019-06-01 03:52:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by s***@gmail.com
Post by HVS
On Thu, 30 May 2019 18:08:13 +0200, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
I'm reading /Proof/, by Dick Francis. A character introduces
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard
soft,
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J.
I pronounce it exactly like that, neither French nor German. Gerald
likewise.
Same here - but with first- or second-syllable stress?
(Second for me, but I think it's widely pronounced with
first-syllable stress in the UK - like "Maurice".)
For me, jur RARD (it matches my YARD, /dZur jArd/)
I assume that "u" is not as in "June".
Post by s***@gmail.com
but JAIR old ( the second syllable is actually between palled and dolled (up),
so /jeIr Old/) (is EI correct? Evan's list has "rarity" in an example,
but it's for the consonant, not the vowel.)
(and /ld/ is almost the second syllable, when I reduce the vowel)
The second syllable has a schwa, or as you say a syllabic l, when I say
it--no "palled" or "dolled".
--
Jerry Friedman
Jerry Friedman
2019-06-01 03:50:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor.
'
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
He pronounced the G of Gerard soft,
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J.
I pronounce it exactly like that, neither French nor German. Gerald likewise.
...
Thanks to you and everyone else.
--
Jerry Friedman
Ross
2019-05-31 04:45:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jerry Friedman
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard soft,
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J. Is that not how it's normally
pronounced in Britain? If it's not, how is it pronounced? Maybe as in
Gérard or as in Gerhardt?
--
Gerald, not Gerard, Friedman
Jones from beginning to end shows four variants of "Gerard", according to
which syllable is stressed and whether the unstressed vowel is reduced.
But of variation in the initial consonant there is none: always /dZ-/.
"Gérard", however, may optionally have /Z-/.
Jerry Friedman
2019-06-01 16:08:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ross
Post by Jerry Friedman
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard soft,
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J. Is that not how it's normally
pronounced in Britain? If it's not, how is it pronounced? Maybe as in
Gérard or as in Gerhardt?
--
Gerald, not Gerard, Friedman
Jones from beginning to end shows four variants of "Gerard", according to
which syllable is stressed and whether the unstressed vowel is reduced.
But of variation in the initial consonant there is none: always /dZ-/.
"Gérard", however, may optionally have /Z-/.
Actually, a little later the narrator says, "Gerard with a soft J", so
maybe he meant /Z/ and didn't express it well, or there was an editing
error, the first time.
--
Jerry Friedman
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2019-06-01 16:15:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Ross
Post by Jerry Friedman
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard soft,
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J. Is that not how it's normally
pronounced in Britain? If it's not, how is it pronounced? Maybe as in
Gérard or as in Gerhardt?
--
Gerald, not Gerard, Friedman
Jones from beginning to end shows four variants of "Gerard", according to
which syllable is stressed and whether the unstressed vowel is reduced.
But of variation in the initial consonant there is none: always /dZ-/.
"Gérard", however, may optionally have /Z-/.
Actually, a little later the narrator says, "Gerard with a soft J", so
maybe he meant /Z/ and didn't express it well, or there was an editing
error, the first time.
That sounds very plausible. When I read the book I don't think I was
held up by this sentence, so I probably assumed he meant a British
attempt at a French pronunciation of Gérard.
--
athel
Bart Dinnissen
2019-06-01 22:29:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Ross
Post by Jerry Friedman
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard soft,
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J. Is that not how it's normally
pronounced in Britain? If it's not, how is it pronounced? Maybe as in
Gérard or as in Gerhardt?
--
Gerald, not Gerard, Friedman
Jones from beginning to end shows four variants of "Gerard", according to
which syllable is stressed and whether the unstressed vowel is reduced.
But of variation in the initial consonant there is none: always /dZ-/.
"Gérard", however, may optionally have /Z-/.
Actually, a little later the narrator says, "Gerard with a soft J", so
maybe he meant /Z/ and didn't express it well, or there was an editing
error, the first time.
That sounds very plausible. When I read the book I don't think I was
held up by this sentence, so I probably assumed he meant a British
attempt at a French pronunciation of Gérard.
Same here.

More important: which wine goes best with mutton? Or anything sweet?
--
Bart Dinnissen
Kerr-Mudd,John
2019-06-02 09:44:54 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 1 Jun 2019 18:15:22 +0200, in alt.usage.english Athel
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Ross
Post by Jerry Friedman
I'm reading /Proof/, by Dick Francis. A character introduces
himself: "'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G
of Gerard soft, like a J, in a voice that was remotely but
detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J. Is that not how it's
normally pronounced in Britain? If it's not, how is it
pronounced? Maybe as in Gérard or as in Gerhardt?
--
Gerald, not Gerard, Friedman
Jones from beginning to end shows four variants of "Gerard",
according to which syllable is stressed and whether the unstressed
vowel is reduced. But of variation in the initial consonant there
is none: always /dZ-/. "Gérard", however, may optionally have /Z-/.
Actually, a little later the narrator says, "Gerard with a soft J",
so maybe he meant /Z/ and didn't express it well, or there was an
editing error, the first time.
That sounds very plausible. When I read the book I don't think I was
held up by this sentence, so I probably assumed he meant a British
attempt at a French pronunciation of Gérard.
Same here.
More important: which wine goes best with mutton? Or anything sweet?
You eat sweetened mutton?
--
Bah, and indeed, Humbug.
Peter Moylan
2019-06-02 01:13:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Jerry Friedman
On Friday, May 31, 2019 at 3:24:13 AM UTC+12, Jerry Friedman
Post by Jerry Friedman
I'm reading /Proof/, by Dick Francis. A character introduces
himself: "'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the
G of Gerard soft, like a J, in a voice that was remotely but
detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J. Is that not how it's
normally pronounced in Britain? If it's not, how is it
pronounced? Maybe as in Gérard or as in Gerhardt?
-- Gerald, not Gerard, Friedman
Jones from beginning to end shows four variants of "Gerard",
according to which syllable is stressed and whether the
unstressed vowel is reduced. But of variation in the initial
consonant there is none: always /dZ-/. "Gérard", however, may
optionally have /Z-/.
Actually, a little later the narrator says, "Gerard with a soft
J", so maybe he meant /Z/ and didn't express it well, or there was
an editing error, the first time.
That sounds very plausible. When I read the book I don't think I was
held up by this sentence, so I probably assumed he meant a British
attempt at a French pronunciation of Gérard.
Right from the beginning of this thread I've felt that "soft, like a J"
was ambiguous. Was that an English J or a French J? I'd expect the
latter, because I think of Gerard as a name imported from French, and
also because the French J is softer than the English one.

(Gerald, on the other hand, is unambiguously English.)
--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW, Australia
Mark Brader
2019-06-02 04:07:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
I'm reading /Proof/, by Dick Francis. A character introduces
himself: "'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the
G of Gerard soft, like a J, in a voice that was remotely but
detectably Scots."
Right from the beginning of this thread I've felt that "soft, like a J"
was ambiguous.
As far as I'm concerned it unambiguously means the sound in "geology"
and most words starting with J. Unless the person was French, I would
pronounce the name Gerard exactly like Gerrard, the street -- "jer-ARD".
Post by Peter Moylan
Was that an English J or a French J? I'd expect the latter...
The passage is in English.
--
Mark Brader | The lawgiver, of all beings, most owes the law allegiance.
Toronto | He of all men should behave as though the law compelled him.
***@vex.net | But it is the universal weakness of mankind that what we are
| given to administer we presently imagine we own. -- Wells

My text in this article is in the public domain.
Quinn C
2019-06-02 16:30:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark Brader
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
I'm reading /Proof/, by Dick Francis. A character introduces
himself: "'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the
G of Gerard soft, like a J, in a voice that was remotely but
detectably Scots."
Right from the beginning of this thread I've felt that "soft, like a J"
was ambiguous.
As far as I'm concerned it unambiguously means the sound in "geology"
and most words starting with J. Unless the person was French, I would
pronounce the name Gerard exactly like Gerrard, the street -- "jer-ARD".
To me, the spelling "Gerrard" would suggest first-syllable stress, as
opposed to "Gerard". But I know that English often ignores the
double-consonant indicator.
--
... it might be nice to see ourselves reflected in TV shows and
Pride season campaigns, but the cis white men who invented the
gender binary still own the damn mirror.
-- Delilah Friedler at slate.com
Peter T. Daniels
2019-06-01 19:00:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Ross
Post by Jerry Friedman
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard soft,
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J. Is that not how it's normally
pronounced in Britain? If it's not, how is it pronounced? Maybe as in
Gérard or as in Gerhardt?
--
Gerald, not Gerard, Friedman
Then why not Gerry?
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Ross
Jones from beginning to end shows four variants of "Gerard", according to
which syllable is stressed and whether the unstressed vowel is reduced.
But of variation in the initial consonant there is none: always /dZ-/.
"Gérard", however, may optionally have /Z-/.
Actually, a little later the narrator says, "Gerard with a soft J", so
maybe he meant /Z/ and didn't express it well, or there was an editing
error, the first time.
It wasn't so long ago that Colbert had some Scottish action-movie star
named Gerald something as a guest, and his accent came up, and he offered
the native pronunciation of his name: Gerard identical to Gerald except
with r instead of l ['***@rd].
Janet
2019-06-01 23:08:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter T. Daniels
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Ross
Post by Jerry Friedman
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard soft,
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J. Is that not how it's normally
pronounced in Britain? If it's not, how is it pronounced? Maybe as in
Gérard or as in Gerhardt?
--
Gerald, not Gerard, Friedman
Then why not Gerry?
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Ross
Jones from beginning to end shows four variants of "Gerard", according to
which syllable is stressed and whether the unstressed vowel is reduced.
But of variation in the initial consonant there is none: always /dZ-/.
"Gérard", however, may optionally have /Z-/.
Actually, a little later the narrator says, "Gerard with a soft J", so
maybe he meant /Z/ and didn't express it well, or there was an editing
error, the first time.
It wasn't so long ago that Colbert had some Scottish action-movie star
named Gerald something as a guest, and his accent came up, and he offered
the native pronunciation of his name: Gerard identical to Gerald except
You mean Gerard Butler. He pronounces his name Gerard not Gerald
because Gerald is not his name.

Janet.
Peter T. Daniels
2019-06-02 02:49:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Janet
Post by Peter T. Daniels
It wasn't so long ago that Colbert had some Scottish action-movie star
named Gerald something as a guest, and his accent came up, and he offered
the native pronunciation of his name: Gerard identical to Gerald except
You mean Gerard Butler. He pronounces his name Gerard not Gerald
because Gerald is not his name.
Is that how carefully you read _everything_ you reply to?

Try going over what I wrote once again, paying especial attention to the
last 7 words (or, if you refuse to read phonetic transcriptions, the last
6-but-one).

(The normal American pronunciation of "Gerard" is [dZ@'rard]. Do I dare
point out that it's the same difference as was found in "Purcell"?)
Janet
2019-06-02 15:29:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter T. Daniels
Post by Janet
Post by Peter T. Daniels
It wasn't so long ago that Colbert had some Scottish action-movie star
named Gerald something as a guest, and his accent came up, and he offered
the native pronunciation of his name: Gerard identical to Gerald except
You mean Gerard Butler. He pronounces his name Gerard not Gerald
because Gerald is not his name.
Is that how carefully you read _everything_ you reply to?
Try going over what I wrote once again, paying especial attention to the
last 7 words (or, if you refuse to read phonetic transcriptions, the last
6-but-one).
I paid special attention when you wrote "Scottish action-movie star
named Gerald".

You got that name wrong. He isnt named Gerald.

Janet.
Post by Peter T. Daniels
point out that it's the same difference as was found in "Purcell"?)
Tony Cooper
2019-06-02 04:56:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Janet
Post by Peter T. Daniels
It wasn't so long ago that Colbert had some Scottish action-movie star
named Gerald something as a guest, and his accent came up, and he offered
the native pronunciation of his name: Gerard identical to Gerald except
You mean Gerard Butler. He pronounces his name Gerard not Gerald
because Gerald is not his name.
I don't understand PTD's contention. The actual interview is here:

https://www.facebook.com/colbertlateshow/videos/gerard-butler-spent-seven-years-studying-practicing-law/582688075486490/

here's the same clip in case the other link doesn't work for you.



Butler clearly says "Gerard" until he pronounces it the Scottish way,
when it's a quick bark of the name. Nothing like "Gerald", though. At
one point Butler pronounces almost like "Jared".

Why, when the subject was first posted a link to the interview wasn't
included when the link is so easy to come up with is beyond me. Typing
in "Gerard Butler Stephen Colbert" is something so monumentally
difficult?

I am still puzzled by "Gerard identical to Gerald except with r
instead of l ['***@rd]".

That's like saying John is identical to Joan except with h instead of
a.

PTD's hemorrhoids will be in a twist when he sees I'm commenting on
"linguistic" subject, to which I reply "Awa' an bile yer heid".
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
Peter T. Daniels
2019-06-02 12:21:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tony Cooper
Post by Janet
Post by Peter T. Daniels
It wasn't so long ago that Colbert had some Scottish action-movie star
named Gerald something as a guest, and his accent came up, and he offered
the native pronunciation of his name: Gerard identical to Gerald except
You mean Gerard Butler. He pronounces his name Gerard not Gerald
because Gerald is not his name.
https://www.facebook.com/colbertlateshow/videos/gerard-butler-spent-seven-years-studying-practicing-law/582688075486490/
here's the same clip in case the other link doesn't work for you.
http://youtu.be/f2m8EFdA1gM
Butler clearly says "Gerard" until he pronounces it the Scottish way,
when it's a quick bark of the name. Nothing like "Gerald", though. At
one point Butler pronounces almost like "Jared".
Well, that proves that T*ny C**o*r's ears are for shit. Not surprising
for one of his age.
Post by Tony Cooper
Why, when the subject was first posted a link to the interview wasn't
included when the link is so easy to come up with is beyond me. Typing
in "Gerard Butler Stephen Colbert" is something so monumentally
difficult?
Is T*ny C**p*r so stupid that he couldn't see that I didn't know the
actor's last name?
Post by Tony Cooper
I am still puzzled by "Gerard identical to Gerald except with r
That's like saying John is identical to Joan except with h instead of
a.
Well, that proves that T*ny C**p*r is terminally stupid quite aside from
being unwilling to learn to interpret the simplest phonetic transcription.
Post by Tony Cooper
PTD's hemorrhoids will be in a twist when he sees I'm commenting on
"linguistic" subject, to which I reply "Awa' an bile yer heid".
He doesn't have any.

T*ny C**p*r just can't resist flaunting his ignorance about the Usage
of English.
Quinn C
2019-06-02 16:28:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tony Cooper
I am still puzzled by "Gerard identical to Gerald except with r
That's like saying John is identical to Joan except with h instead of
a.
Yeah. Anything wrong with that? It's a correct description of the
spelling of "John" (but not the pronunciation in this case.)
--
It was frequently the fastest way to find what he was looking
for, provided that he was looking for trouble.
-- L. McMaster Bujold, Gentleman Jole and the Red Queen
Jerry Friedman
2019-06-02 03:56:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter T. Daniels
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Ross
Post by Jerry Friedman
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard soft,
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J. Is that not how it's normally
pronounced in Britain? If it's not, how is it pronounced? Maybe as in
Gérard or as in Gerhardt?
--
Gerald, not Gerard, Friedman
Then why not Gerry?
Tradition, same as Jerry Ford, Jerry Brown, Jerry Springer, and of
course Lord Peter Wimsey's oldest nephew.

With apologies to those who have seen this from me before--my parents
named me Yitzchak after a great-grandfather, and then wanted an English
name that began with a J. (I suppose they eliminated "Isaac", which
would become popular a generation later, and wisely eliminated all the
alternative I names, such as "Isidore" and "Irving".) They picked
"Jerry", and then they needed a name for that to be a nickname for, so
they picked "Gerald".
Post by Peter T. Daniels
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Ross
Jones from beginning to end shows four variants of "Gerard", according to
which syllable is stressed and whether the unstressed vowel is reduced.
But of variation in the initial consonant there is none: always /dZ-/.
"Gérard", however, may optionally have /Z-/.
Actually, a little later the narrator says, "Gerard with a soft J", so
maybe he meant /Z/ and didn't express it well, or there was an editing
error, the first time.
It wasn't so long ago that Colbert had some Scottish action-movie star
named Gerald
You must mean "Gerard".
Post by Peter T. Daniels
something as a guest, and his accent came up, and he offered
the native pronunciation of his name: Gerard identical to Gerald except
--
Jerry Friedman
Peter Moylan
2019-06-02 04:20:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jerry Friedman
With apologies to those who have seen this from me before--my parents
named me Yitzchak after a great-grandfather, and then wanted an
English name that began with a J. (I suppose they eliminated
"Isaac", which would become popular a generation later, and wisely
eliminated all the alternative I names, such as "Isidore" and
"Irving".) They picked "Jerry", and then they needed a name for that
to be a nickname for, so they picked "Gerald".
So a case could be made that your English name is really Jerry, and
Gerald is just a nickname.
--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW, Australia
Jerry Friedman
2019-06-02 18:14:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
With apologies to those who have seen this from me before--my parents
 named me Yitzchak
That's probably misleading, since they had not intention of calling me
Yitzchak under most circumstances. They gave me the Hebrew name Yitzchak.

after a great-grandfather, and then wanted an
Post by Peter Moylan
Post by Jerry Friedman
English name that began with a J.  (I suppose they eliminated
"Isaac", which would become popular a generation later, and wisely
eliminated all the alternative I names, such as "Isidore" and
"Irving".) They picked "Jerry", and then they needed a name for that
to be a nickname for, so they picked "Gerald".
So a case could be made that your English name is really Jerry, and
Gerald is just a nickname.
Not a legal case. It might be relevant to the illegal I mean non-legal
case that only a few people call me Gerald.
--
Jerry Friedman
Peter T. Daniels
2019-06-02 12:17:12 UTC
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Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Peter T. Daniels
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Ross
Post by Jerry Friedman
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard soft,
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J. Is that not how it's normally
pronounced in Britain? If it's not, how is it pronounced? Maybe as in
Gérard or as in Gerhardt?
--
Gerald, not Gerard, Friedman
Then why not Gerry?
Tradition, same as Jerry Ford, Jerry Brown, Jerry Springer, and of
course Lord Peter Wimsey's oldest nephew.
With apologies to those who have seen this from me before--my parents
named me Yitzchak after a great-grandfather, and then wanted an English
name that began with a J. (I suppose they eliminated "Isaac", which
would become popular a generation later, and wisely eliminated all the
alternative I names, such as "Isidore" and "Irving".) They picked
"Jerry", and then they needed a name for that to be a nickname for, so
they picked "Gerald".
Famed syntactician Jerry Sadock is Jerrold.
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Peter T. Daniels
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Ross
Jones from beginning to end shows four variants of "Gerard", according to
which syllable is stressed and whether the unstressed vowel is reduced.
But of variation in the initial consonant there is none: always /dZ-/.
"Gérard", however, may optionally have /Z-/.
Actually, a little later the narrator says, "Gerard with a soft J", so
maybe he meant /Z/ and didn't express it well, or there was an editing
error, the first time.
It wasn't so long ago that Colbert had some Scottish action-movie star
named Gerald
You must mean "Gerard".
Never noticed that. So _that's_ what Janet was "on about"!
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Peter T. Daniels
something as a guest, and his accent came up, and he offered
the native pronunciation of his name: Gerard identical to Gerald except
David Kleinecke
2019-06-02 15:26:55 UTC
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Post by Peter T. Daniels
Famed syntactician Jerry Sadock is Jerrold.
I know a Jerry named Jerome.

Yes - lapsed Catholic.
Janet
2019-06-02 17:06:52 UTC
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Post by Peter T. Daniels
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Peter T. Daniels
It wasn't so long ago that Colbert had some Scottish action-movie star
named Gerald
You must mean "Gerard".
Never noticed that. So _that's_ what Janet was "on about"!
" Is that how carefully you read _everything_ you reply to?
Try going over what I wrote once again, paying especial attention "



Janet
Spains Harden
2019-06-07 17:59:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jerry Friedman
"'Mine's McGregor. Gerard McGregor. He pronounced the G of Gerard soft,
like a J, in a voice that was remotely but detectably Scots."
I pronounce the G in Gerard like a J. Is that not how it's normally
pronounced in Britain? If it's not, how is it pronounced? Maybe as in
Gérard or as in Gerhardt?
My grandparents in North London rehoused a "Gerhardt" off the very last
Kinder Transporten, and he became "Gerrard" with a very hard "G".
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