Discussion:
in the foreseeable near future vs in the foreseeablely near future.
(too old to reply)
Hongyi Zhao
2020-06-08 13:53:59 UTC
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Hi,

in the foreseeable near future vs in the foreseeablely near future.

Which one is correct?
Peter T. Daniels
2020-06-08 14:39:52 UTC
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On Monday, June 8, 2020 at 9:54:03 AM UTC-4, Hongyi Zhao wrote:
If
Post by Hongyi Zhao
in the foreseeable near future vs in the foreseeablely near future.
Which one is correct?
Neither.

in the foreseeable future
in the near future

If there were a reason to use "foreseeably," that's how it would be spelled.

Cf. ably, capably, understandably ...
Spains Harden
2020-06-08 16:00:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter T. Daniels
If
Post by Hongyi Zhao
in the foreseeable near future vs in the foreseeablely near future.
Which one is correct?
Neither.
"Near" and "foreseeable" can't be daisy-chained as adjectives?

Both are correct after PTD's spelling correction. One is the near
future you can see; the other is the future you could see. Either way
you'd need to have your eyes wide open.
Post by Peter T. Daniels
in the foreseeable future
in the near future
If there were a reason to use "foreseeably," that's how it would be spelled.
Cf. ably, capably, understandably ...
Peter T. Daniels
2020-06-08 18:20:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Spains Harden
Post by Peter T. Daniels
If
Post by Hongyi Zhao
in the foreseeable near future vs in the foreseeablely near future.
Which one is correct?
Neither.
"Near" and "foreseeable" can't be daisy-chained as adjectives?
Both are correct after PTD's spelling correction. One is the near
future you can see; the other is the future you could see. Either way
you'd need to have your eyes wide open.
At best, it's redundant.
Post by Spains Harden
Post by Peter T. Daniels
in the foreseeable future
in the near future
If there were a reason to use "foreseeably," that's how it would be spelled.
Cf. ably, capably, understandably ...
Hongyi Zhao
2020-06-08 23:49:42 UTC
Permalink
在 2020年6月9日星期二 UTC+8上午12:00:46，Spains Harden写道：
Post by Spains Harden
Post by Peter T. Daniels
If
Post by Hongyi Zhao
in the foreseeable near future vs in the foreseeablely near future.
Which one is correct?
Neither.
"Near" and "foreseeable" can't be daisy-chained as adjectives?
Both are correct after PTD's spelling correction. One is the near
future you can see; the other is the future you could see. Either way
you'd need to have your eyes wide open.
Is *open* used here a noun?
Post by Spains Harden
Post by Peter T. Daniels
in the foreseeable future
in the near future
If there were a reason to use "foreseeably," that's how it would be spelled.
Cf. ably, capably, understandably ...
Snidely
2020-06-11 01:22:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hongyi Zhao
在 2020年6月9日星期二 UTC+8上午12:00:46，Spains Harden写道：
Post by Spains Harden
Post by Peter T. Daniels
If
Post by Hongyi Zhao
in the foreseeable near future vs in the foreseeablely near future.
Which one is correct?
Neither.
"Near" and "foreseeable" can't be daisy-chained as adjectives?
Both are correct after PTD's spelling correction. One is the near
future you can see; the other is the future you could see. Either way
you'd need to have your eyes wide open.
Is *open* used here a noun?
"Is *open* used here /as/ a noun?"
"Is *open* /as/ used here a noun?"

It's a state or attribute. Compare "you'd need to have your eyes
covered" or "you need to have blue eyes". I could see the argument for
both adjective and noun.

"wide open" is the typical phrase, especially for eyes, but one could
also say "widely opened"; that's a correct term, but not very common.

/dps
--
"I am not given to exaggeration, and when I say a thing I mean it"
_Roughing It_, Mark Twain
CDB
2020-06-13 05:17:44 UTC
Permalink
On 6/8/2020 12:28 PM, Van Ly wrote:
[>> ?]
Post by Peter T. Daniels
If there were a reason to use "foreseeably," that's how it would be spelled.
Cf. ably, capably, understandably ...
For cadence?
I don't hear much difference in cadence berween the two.
If in any composition much attention was paid to the flow of the
rhythm, it was said (at least in the 14th and 15th centuries) to be
"prosed in faire cadence." --Dr. Guest.
[1913 Webster]
VanL
-- ... dragons do not see stones, fish do not see water.
s***@my-deja.com
2020-06-08 22:49:37 UTC
Permalink
Hi, in the foreseeable near future vs
in the foreseeablely near future.
Which one is correct?
I would say that the "foreseeable future" is best because it gives
a clearer idear of how far ahead you are looking.
b***@shaw.ca
2020-06-08 23:43:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by s***@my-deja.com
Hi, in the foreseeable near future vs
in the foreseeablely near future.
Which one is correct?
I would say that the "foreseeable future" is best because it gives
a clearer idear of how far ahead you are looking.
Not really. "Near future" and "foreseeable future" can mean different
things, depending on context. "Foreseeable" can be near or distant
in time.

bill
Hongyi Zhao
2020-06-08 23:57:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@shaw.ca
Post by s***@my-deja.com
Hi, in the foreseeable near future vs
in the foreseeablely near future.
Which one is correct?
I would say that the "foreseeable future" is best because it gives
a clearer idear of how far ahead you are looking.
Not really. "Near future" and "foreseeable future" can mean different
things, depending on context. "Foreseeable" can be near or distant
in time.
If so, why cannot I daisy-chained the both into one to confirm / clarify the meaning?
Post by b***@shaw.ca
bill
s***@my-deja.com
2020-06-09 00:31:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hongyi Zhao
Post by b***@shaw.ca
Post by s***@my-deja.com
Hi, in the foreseeable near future vs
in the foreseeablely near future.
Which one is correct?
I would say that the "foreseeable future" is best because it gives
a clearer idear of how far ahead you are looking.
Not really. "Near future" and "foreseeable future" can mean different
things, depending on context. "Foreseeable" can be near or distant
in time.
If so, why cannot I daisy-chained the both into one to
confirm / clarify the meaning?
In that case "foreseeably near", an adjective modified by an adverb
Hongyi Zhao
2020-06-09 02:55:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by s***@my-deja.com
Post by Hongyi Zhao
Post by b***@shaw.ca
Post by s***@my-deja.com
Hi, in the foreseeable near future vs
in the foreseeablely near future.
Which one is correct?
I would say that the "foreseeable future" is best because it gives
a clearer idear of how far ahead you are looking.
Not really. "Near future" and "foreseeable future" can mean different
things, depending on context. "Foreseeable" can be near or distant
in time.
If so, why cannot I daisy-chained the both into one to
confirm / clarify the meaning?
In that case "foreseeably near", an adjective modified by an adverb
As we all know, there has noun-noun compound noun. Why cann't I make a adjective-adjective compound adjective?
Stefan Ram
2020-06-09 03:14:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hongyi Zhao
As we all know, there has noun-noun compound noun.
In a noun-noun compound, the first noun functions
as a modifier, which is kind of like an adjective.
Post by Hongyi Zhao
Why cann't I make a adjective-adjective compound adjective?
Adjectives modify nouns. Those things that modify
adjectives are called adverbs.

Sometimes, an adverb can be formed from an adjective.

"high" (adj.) + "respected" (adj.) -->
"highly" (adv.) + "respected" (adj.)

"a respected scholar", "a highly respected scholar"
s***@my-deja.com
2020-06-09 10:56:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hongyi Zhao
As we all know, there has noun-noun compound noun. Why cann't I make a adjective-adjective compound adjective?
As a teacher of English as a second language I would advise:-
When learning a new language it is better to find a form of expression
which reliably conveys what you want to say rather than asking
"Why can't I use this other way instead?".

As an adult learner I have watched another person in the class do this,
and wondered why he did not just accept and remember the way that worked.

I am sorry if this sounds a little bit harsh. It really is intended to help
and speed up the learning process.
b***@shaw.ca
2020-06-09 03:18:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hongyi Zhao
Post by b***@shaw.ca
Post by s***@my-deja.com
Hi, in the foreseeable near future vs
in the foreseeablely near future.
Which one is correct?
I would say that the "foreseeable future" is best because it gives
a clearer idear of how far ahead you are looking.
Not really. "Near future" and "foreseeable future" can mean different
things, depending on context. "Foreseeable" can be near or distant
in time.
If so, why cannot I daisy-chained the both into one to confirm / clarify the meaning?
You would have to make a complicated distinction. If you daisy-chain
them as either "near foreseeable future" or "foreseeable near future",
you are implying that there is also a distant foreseeable future, or an
unforeseeable near future. I'd look for a simpler way to convey your
meaning.

bill
Stefan Ram
2020-06-09 03:35:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@shaw.ca
them as either "near foreseeable future" or "foreseeable near future",
you are implying that there is also a distant foreseeable future
If the "forseeable future" is a time range of positive (but
finite) length, it can be divided into two parts of equal
duration, one of which is nearer to us and one of which is
further away.

If "near foreseeable future" sounds too strange, it might be
written as "near and foreseeable future", which might not
have exactly the same meaning but might be preferred by some
for stylistic reasons.
Peter Moylan
2020-06-09 04:23:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Spains Harden
daisy-chain
Post by b***@shaw.ca
them as either "near foreseeable future" or "foreseeable near
future", you are implying that there is also a distant foreseeable
future
If the "forseeable future" is a time range of positive (but finite)
length, it can be divided into two parts of equal duration, one of
which is nearer to us and one of which is further away.
If that is true, then you're talking about only a subset of the
foreseeable future. That means "In the near future" would be a more
accurate way of saying it.

If the near future is equal to the foreseeable future, then "foreseeable
near future" is redundant, and therefore bad style.

If they are not equal, then "foreseeable near future" is a
contradiction, so still bad style.

Just use one or the other adjective, depending on what you mean.
--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
s***@my-deja.com
2020-06-09 00:34:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@shaw.ca
Post by s***@my-deja.com
Hi, in the foreseeable near future vs
in the foreseeablely near future.
Which one is correct?
I would say that the "foreseeable future" is best because it gives
a clearer idear of how far ahead you are looking.
Not really. "Near future" and "foreseeable future" can mean different
things, depending on context. "Foreseeable" can be near or distant
in time.
Of course you are correct in absolute terms.
Perhaps I have too little faith in the future?
b***@shaw.ca
2020-06-09 03:19:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by s***@my-deja.com
Post by b***@shaw.ca
Post by s***@my-deja.com
Hi, in the foreseeable near future vs
in the foreseeablely near future.
Which one is correct?
I would say that the "foreseeable future" is best because it gives
a clearer idear of how far ahead you are looking.
Not really. "Near future" and "foreseeable future" can mean different
things, depending on context. "Foreseeable" can be near or distant
in time.
Of course you are correct in absolute terms.
Perhaps I have too little faith in the future?
Just tell your interlocutor that whatever will be, will be.

bill
Van Ly
2020-06-09 06:02:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@shaw.ca
Post by s***@my-deja.com
Hi, in the foreseeable near future vs
in the foreseeablely near future.
Which one is correct?
I would say that the "foreseeable future" is best because it gives
a clearer idear of how far ahead you are looking.
Not really. "Near future" and "foreseeable future" can mean different
things, depending on context. "Foreseeable" can be near or distant
in time.
Would sighted and blind writers prefer foreseeable or near
differently?

VanL

--
... dragons do not see stones, fish do not see water.
CDB
2020-06-13 05:17:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Van Ly
Post by b***@shaw.ca
Post by s***@my-deja.com
Hi, in the foreseeable near future vs in the foreseeablely
near future. Which one is correct?
I would say that the "foreseeable future" is best because it
gives a clearer idear of how far ahead you are looking.
Not really. "Near future" and "foreseeable future" can mean
different things, depending on context. "Foreseeable" can be near
or distant in time.
I agree. The forseeable near future is that part of the near future
that can be foreseen; the foreseeably near future is that part of the
future that is near enough to be foreseen.
Post by Van Ly
Would sighted and blind writers prefer foreseeable or near
differently?
That is probably a matter of individual preference. I have met blind
people who are comfortable with the metaphorical uses of "see".
Post by Van Ly
VanL
-- ... dragons do not see stones, fish do not see water.
I would be grateful if you could retain the attribution block in your
responses. I don't remember who I was agreeing with, above.
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2020-06-13 06:38:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by CDB
Post by Van Ly
Post by b***@shaw.ca
Post by s***@my-deja.com
Hi, in the foreseeable near future vs in the foreseeablely
near future. Which one is correct?
I would say that the "foreseeable future" is best because it
gives a clearer idear of how far ahead you are looking.
Not really. "Near future" and "foreseeable future" can mean
different things, depending on context. "Foreseeable" can be near
or distant in time.
I agree. The forseeable near future is that part of the near future
that can be foreseen; the foreseeably near future is that part of the
future that is near enough to be foreseen.
Post by Van Ly
Would sighted and blind writers prefer foreseeable or near
differently?
That is probably a matter of individual preference. I have met blind
people who are comfortable with the metaphorical uses of "see".
Post by Van Ly
VanL
-- ... dragons do not see stones, fish do not see water.
I would be grateful if you could retain the attribution block in your
responses. I don't remember who I was agreeing with, above.
He may just be trying to show that it's possible to do a worse job of
it than Mark Brader does.
--
athel
RH Draney
2020-06-13 07:00:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Van Ly
Would sighted and blind writers prefer foreseeable or near
differently?
That is probably a matter of individual preference.  I have met blind
people who are comfortable with the metaphorical uses of "see".
"I see", said the blind carpenter, as he picked up his hammer and saw....r
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2020-06-13 07:58:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by RH Draney
Post by Van Ly
Would sighted and blind writers prefer foreseeable or near
differently?
That is probably a matter of individual preference.  I have met blind
people who are comfortable with the metaphorical uses of "see".
"I see", said the blind carpenter, as he picked up his hammer and saw....r
"I see", said the blind watchmaker when he selected human ancestors
from a pool of apes.
--
athel
Peter T. Daniels
2020-06-13 13:54:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by RH Draney
"I see", said the blind carpenter, as he picked up his hammer and saw....r
"I see", said the blind watchmaker when he selected human ancestors
from a pool of apes.
Aha -- you subscribe to the "aquatic ape" theory.
Peter T. Daniels
2020-06-13 13:54:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by RH Draney
Post by Van Ly
Would sighted and blind writers prefer foreseeable or near
differently?
That is probably a matter of individual preference.  I have met blind
people who are comfortable with the metaphorical uses of "see".
A discussion to that effect is all but inevitable whenever a sitcom,
or even a drama, features a blind character. Unfortunately they are
usually played by sighted actors. Wheelchair Guy on *Superstore* is
not paraplegic.
Post by RH Draney
"I see", said the blind carpenter, as he picked up his hammer and saw....r
One fine morning in the middle of the night,
Two dead boys got up to fight.
Back to back they faced each other,
Drew their swords and shot each other.
A deaf policeman heard the noise
And came to kill the two dead boys.

Fourth grade? third grade? Did anyone else have that poem or similar?

I didn't like the repetition and tried to change the second to "one another,"
but apparently violating the meter was more heinous than rhyming a phrase
with itself.
phil
2020-06-13 16:19:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter T. Daniels
Post by RH Draney
Post by Van Ly
Would sighted and blind writers prefer foreseeable or near
differently?
That is probably a matter of individual preference.  I have met blind
people who are comfortable with the metaphorical uses of "see".
A discussion to that effect is all but inevitable whenever a sitcom,
or even a drama, features a blind character. Unfortunately they are
usually played by sighted actors. Wheelchair Guy on *Superstore* is
not paraplegic.
Post by RH Draney
"I see", said the blind carpenter, as he picked up his hammer and saw....r
One fine morning in the middle of the night,
Two dead boys got up to fight.
Back to back they faced each other,
Drew their swords and shot each other.
A deaf policeman heard the noise
And came to kill the two dead boys.
Fourth grade? third grade? Did anyone else have that poem or similar?
I didn't like the repetition and tried to change the second to "one another,"
but apparently violating the meter was more heinous than rhyming a phrase
with itself.
The two lines

"Back to back they faced each other,
Drew their swords and shot each other"

rang a bell. Sometime in the 1960s. I thought it might be from "Verse
and Worse", but a quick check doesn't find it there.
Jerry Friedman
2020-06-13 17:21:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter T. Daniels
Post by RH Draney
Post by Van Ly
Would sighted and blind writers prefer foreseeable or near
differently?
That is probably a matter of individual preference.  I have met blind
people who are comfortable with the metaphorical uses of "see".
A discussion to that effect is all but inevitable whenever a sitcom,
or even a drama, features a blind character. Unfortunately they are
usually played by sighted actors. Wheelchair Guy on *Superstore* is
not paraplegic.
Post by RH Draney
"I see", said the blind carpenter, as he picked up his hammer and saw....r
One fine morning in the middle of the night,
Two dead boys got up to fight.
Back to back they faced each other,
Drew their swords and shot each other.
A deaf policeman heard the noise
And came to kill the two dead boys.
If you don't believe my story is true,
Ask the blind man--he saw it too.
Post by Peter T. Daniels
Fourth grade? third grade? Did anyone else have that poem or similar?
...

Yep.
--
Jerry Friedman
RH Draney
2020-06-13 18:28:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Peter T. Daniels
One fine morning in the middle of the night,
Two dead boys got up to fight.
Back to back they faced each other,
Drew their swords and shot each other.
A deaf policeman heard the noise
And came to kill the two dead boys.
If you don't believe my story is true,
Ask the blind man--he saw it too.
Looking through a knothole in a barbed-wire fence....r
Peter T. Daniels
2020-06-13 19:48:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Peter T. Daniels
Post by RH Draney
Post by Van Ly
Would sighted and blind writers prefer foreseeable or near
differently?
That is probably a matter of individual preference.  I have met blind
people who are comfortable with the metaphorical uses of "see".
A discussion to that effect is all but inevitable whenever a sitcom,
or even a drama, features a blind character. Unfortunately they are
usually played by sighted actors. Wheelchair Guy on *Superstore* is
not paraplegic.
Post by RH Draney
"I see", said the blind carpenter, as he picked up his hammer and saw....r
One fine morning in the middle of the night,
Two dead boys got up to fight.
Back to back they faced each other,
Drew their swords and shot each other.
A deaf policeman heard the noise
And came to kill the two dead boys.
If you don't believe my story is true,
story's
Post by Jerry Friedman
Ask the blind man--he saw it too.
Of course! How can I have forgotten that?

Especially since it's presumably what caused the whole thing to swim
into my ken in the context. (In psychology they call that "priming.")
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Peter T. Daniels
Fourth grade? third grade? Did anyone else have that poem or similar?
...
Yep.
But some years later and a good 500 miles west.

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