"frou frou" vs. "chichi": a difference?

[Berkeley Brett]

I wonder....

Is there a subtle difference between "frou frou" and "chichi" that the
*stylish* speaker of English should know? :P

Some relevant references:

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/frou-frou

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/chichi

--
Brett
http://www.100bestwebsites.org/
"The 100 finest sites on the Web, all in one place!"
Widely-watched non-profit ranking of top Internet sites

[Cece]

Post by Berkeley Brett
I wonder....
Is there a subtle difference between "frou frou" and "chichi" that the
*stylish* speaker of English should know? :P
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/frou-frou
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/chichi
--
Bretthttp://www.100bestwebsites.org/
"The 100 finest sites on the Web, all in one place!"
Widely-watched non-profit ranking of top Internet sites

To me, "frou frou" indicates frilliness, ruffles on an item. "Chi-
chi" implies that the user or wearer of the item considers that item
to be extremely fashionable, no matter how impractical or silly it is.

[tinwhistler]

Post by Berkeley Brett
I wonder....
Is there a subtle difference between "frou frou" and "chichi" that the
*stylish* speaker of English should know? :P
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/frou-frou
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/chichi
--
Bretthttp://www.100bestwebsites.org/
"The 100 finest sites on the Web, all in one place!"
Widely-watched non-profit ranking of top Internet sites

To me, "frou frou" indicates frilliness, ruffles on an item.  "Chi-
chi" implies that the user or wearer of the item considers that item
to be extremely fashionable, no matter how impractical or silly it is.

The Hawaiian muumuu is frilly with ruffles, and the wearers consider
themselves fashionable despite their looking extremely silly. Should
we then call this muumuu frou frou chi chi?
--
Aloha ~~~ Ozzie Maland ~~~ San Diego

[Cece]

Post by tinwhistler

Post by Berkeley Brett
I wonder....
Is there a subtle difference between "frou frou" and "chichi" that the
*stylish* speaker of English should know? :P
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/frou-frou
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/chichi
--
Bretthttp://www.100bestwebsites.org/
"The 100 finest sites on the Web, all in one place!"
Widely-watched non-profit ranking of top Internet sites

To me, "frou frou" indicates frilliness, ruffles on an item.  "Chi-
chi" implies that the user or wearer of the item considers that item
to be extremely fashionable, no matter how impractical or silly it is.

The Hawaiian muumuu is frilly with ruffles, and the wearers consider
themselves fashionable despite their looking extremely silly.  Should
we then call this muumuu frou frou chi chi?
--
Aloha ~~~ Ozzie Maland ~~~ San Diego- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

I've never seen any frills or ruffles on a muumuu.

[Maria C.]

Post by Cece

Post by tinwhistler

Post by Berkeley Brett
I wonder....
Is there a subtle difference between "frou frou" and "chichi" that
the *stylish* speaker of English should know? :P
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/frou-frou
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/chichi

To me, "frou frou" indicates frilliness, ruffles on an item. "Chi-
chi" implies that the user or wearer of the item considers that item
to be extremely fashionable, no matter how impractical or silly it is.

The Hawaiian muumuu is frilly with ruffles, and the wearers consider
themselves fashionable despite their looking extremely silly. Should
we then call this muumuu frou frou chi chi?

I've never seen any frills or ruffles on a muumuu.

If you click on this URL, you will have....

Loading Image...

[Peter Duncanson (BrE)]

Post by Maria C.

Post by Cece

Post by tinwhistler

Post by Berkeley Brett
I wonder....
Is there a subtle difference between "frou frou" and "chichi" that
the *stylish* speaker of English should know? :P
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/frou-frou
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/chichi

To me, "frou frou" indicates frilliness, ruffles on an item. "Chi-
chi" implies that the user or wearer of the item considers that item
to be extremely fashionable, no matter how impractical or silly it is.

The Hawaiian muumuu is frilly with ruffles, and the wearers consider
themselves fashionable despite their looking extremely silly. Should
we then call this muumuu frou frou chi chi?

I've never seen any frills or ruffles on a muumuu.

If you click on this URL, you will have....
http://site.hawaiianoutpost.com/images/wallpapers/blue-muumuu.jpg

I hope she didn't have to sit too long. That rock looks very uncomfortable.

[tinwhistler]

Post by Maria C.

Post by Cece

Post by tinwhistler

Post by Berkeley Brett
I wonder....
Is there a subtle difference between "frou frou" and "chichi" that
the *stylish* speaker of English should know? :P
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/frou-frou
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/chichi

To me, "frou frou" indicates frilliness, ruffles on an item. "Chi-
chi" implies that the user or wearer of the item considers that item
to be extremely fashionable, no matter how impractical or silly it is.

The Hawaiian muumuu is frilly with ruffles, and the wearers consider
themselves fashionable despite their looking extremely silly. Should
we then call this muumuu frou frou chi chi?

I've never seen any frills or ruffles on a muumuu.

If you click on this URL, you will have....
http://site.hawaiianoutpost.com/images/wallpapers/blue-muumuu.jpg
--
Maria C.

Thanks -- that pic looks pretty stereotypical of the muumuu to me.
But maybe the one pictured is a chi chi frou frou muumuu?
--
Aloha ~~~ Ozzie Maland ~~~ San Diego

[R H Draney]

Post by tinwhistler
Thanks -- that pic looks pretty stereotypical of the muumuu to me.
But maybe the one pictured is a chi chi frou frou muumuu?

Of the sort they wear from Pago Pago to Walla Walla....r

[Chuck Riggs]

Post by Maria C.

Post by Cece

Post by tinwhistler

Post by Berkeley Brett
I wonder....
Is there a subtle difference between "frou frou" and "chichi" that
the *stylish* speaker of English should know? :P
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/frou-frou
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/chichi

To me, "frou frou" indicates frilliness, ruffles on an item. "Chi-
chi" implies that the user or wearer of the item considers that item
to be extremely fashionable, no matter how impractical or silly it is.

The Hawaiian muumuu is frilly with ruffles, and the wearers consider
themselves fashionable despite their looking extremely silly. Should
we then call this muumuu frou frou chi chi?

I've never seen any frills or ruffles on a muumuu.

If you click on this URL, you will have....
http://site.hawaiianoutpost.com/images/wallpapers/blue-muumuu.jpg

This is typical of the muumuus I've seen in Hawaii:

Loading Image...

I don't believe there are any frills or ruffles on it.

[Maria C.]

Post by Chuck Riggs

Post by Maria C.

Post by Cece
I've never seen any frills or ruffles on a muumuu.

If you click on this URL, you will have....
http://site.hawaiianoutpost.com/images/wallpapers/blue-muumuu.jpg

http://www.waveshoppe.com/images/Hawaiian-dresses/muumuu.jpg
I don't believe there are any frills or ruffles on it.

Right -- no frills/ruffles on the /typical/ muumuu. But there are
variations that can be found.

[Isabelle Cecchini]

Post by Maria C.

Post by Chuck Riggs

Post by Maria C.

Post by Cece
I've never seen any frills or ruffles on a muumuu.

If you click on this URL, you will have....
http://site.hawaiianoutpost.com/images/wallpapers/blue-muumuu.jpg

http://www.waveshoppe.com/images/Hawaiian-dresses/muumuu.jpg
I don't believe there are any frills or ruffles on it.

Right -- no frills/ruffles on the /typical/ muumuu. But there are
variations that can be found.

I might be mistaken, but I think I can detect a width of material down
at the bottom of the dress on the URL provided by Chuck which looks more
pleated or gathered than at the top.

While not exactly a frill, might it count as a flounce?

In my mind, frills are more, well, frilly than flounces, but I'm having
some difficulty finding a dictionary which could bear this out.

What say you, gentle native speakers? Do you make a difference between a
frill and a flounce?

[Chuck Riggs]

On Sun, 11 Jan 2009 20:05:58 +0100, Isabelle Cecchini

Post by Isabelle Cecchini

Post by Maria C.

Post by Chuck Riggs

Post by Maria C.

Post by Cece
I've never seen any frills or ruffles on a muumuu.

If you click on this URL, you will have....
http://site.hawaiianoutpost.com/images/wallpapers/blue-muumuu.jpg

http://www.waveshoppe.com/images/Hawaiian-dresses/muumuu.jpg
I don't believe there are any frills or ruffles on it.

Right -- no frills/ruffles on the /typical/ muumuu. But there are
variations that can be found.

I might be mistaken, but I think I can detect a width of material down
at the bottom of the dress on the URL provided by Chuck which looks more
pleated or gathered than at the top.
While not exactly a frill, might it count as a flounce?
In my mind, frills are more, well, frilly than flounces, but I'm having
some difficulty finding a dictionary which could bear this out.
What say you, gentle native speakers? Do you make a difference between a
frill and a flounce?

A flounce I'll have to accept, not knowing what one is, but I maintain
that true muumuus incorporate no frills.

[Arcadian Rises]

Post by Chuck Riggs
On Sun, 11 Jan 2009 20:05:58 +0100, Isabelle Cecchini

Post by Isabelle Cecchini

Post by Maria C.

Post by Chuck Riggs

Post by Maria C.

Post by Cece
I've never seen any frills or ruffles on a muumuu.

If you click on this URL, you will have....
http://site.hawaiianoutpost.com/images/wallpapers/blue-muumuu.jpg

http://www.waveshoppe.com/images/Hawaiian-dresses/muumuu.jpg
I don't believe there are any frills or ruffles on it.

Right -- no frills/ruffles on the /typical/ muumuu. But there are
variations that can be found.

I might be mistaken, but I think I can detect a width of material down
at the bottom of the dress on the URL provided by Chuck which looks more
pleated or gathered than at the top.
While not exactly a frill, might it count as a flounce?
In my mind, frills are more, well, frilly than flounces, but I'm having
some difficulty finding a dictionary which could bear this out.
What say you, gentle native speakers? Do you make a difference between a
frill and a flounce?

A flounce I'll have to accept, not knowing what one is, but I maintain
that true muumuus incorporate no frills.
--
Regards,
Chuck Riggs
Near Dublin, Ireland- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

My understanding is that "frill" is a larger notion that encompasses,
among other adornments, "flounces".

[Chuck Riggs]

On Mon, 12 Jan 2009 03:12:43 -0800 (PST), Arcadian Rises

Post by Arcadian Rises

Post by Chuck Riggs
On Sun, 11 Jan 2009 20:05:58 +0100, Isabelle Cecchini

Post by Isabelle Cecchini

Post by Maria C.

Post by Chuck Riggs

Post by Maria C.

Post by Cece
I've never seen any frills or ruffles on a muumuu.

If you click on this URL, you will have....
http://site.hawaiianoutpost.com/images/wallpapers/blue-muumuu.jpg

http://www.waveshoppe.com/images/Hawaiian-dresses/muumuu.jpg
I don't believe there are any frills or ruffles on it.

Right -- no frills/ruffles on the /typical/ muumuu. But there are
variations that can be found.

I might be mistaken, but I think I can detect a width of material down
at the bottom of the dress on the URL provided by Chuck which looks more
pleated or gathered than at the top.
While not exactly a frill, might it count as a flounce?
In my mind, frills are more, well, frilly than flounces, but I'm having
some difficulty finding a dictionary which could bear this out.
What say you, gentle native speakers? Do you make a difference between a
frill and a flounce?

A flounce I'll have to accept, not knowing what one is, but I maintain
that true muumuus incorporate no frills.
--
Regards,
Chuck Riggs
Near Dublin, Ireland- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

My understanding is that "frill" is a larger notion that encompasses,
among other adornments, "flounces".

I think you have it. Merriam-Webster calls a flounce a wide ruffle,
although the COD doesn't make a clear distinction. COD10 has:

flounce
n. a wide ornamental strip of material gathered and sewn to a skirt or
dress; a frill.
DERIVATIVES flounced adj. flouncy adj.
ORIGIN C18: from an alt. of obs. frounce ‘a fold or pleat’, from OFr.
fronce.

[Barbara Bailey]

Post by Berkeley Brett
I wonder....
Is there a subtle difference between "frou frou" and "chichi" that the
*stylish* speaker of English should know? :P
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/frou-frou
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/chichi

In speaking about fashion, "frou-frou" implies overly fussy, frilled or
heavily decorated, as with lace, ruffles, or ribbons. "Chichi" is trendy,
in an ostentatious way.

These shoes are chichi:
<http://preview.tinyurl.com/9bpm94>
or
<http://www.neimanmarcus.com/store/catalog/prod.jhtml?itemId=prod53480047
&parentId=cat17520731&masterId=cat7230758&index=0
&cmCat=cat000000cat980731cat6000734cat11000734cat7230758cat17520731>

These are frou-frou:
<http://www.zappos.com/n/p/dp/32557449/c/632.html>
as are these:
<http://www.zappos.com/n/p/dp/29924531/c/83100.html>

[James Silverton]

Post by Barbara Bailey

Post by Berkeley Brett
I wonder....
Is there a subtle difference between "frou frou" and "chichi"
that the *stylish* speaker of English should know? :P
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/frou-frou
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/chichi

In speaking about fashion, "frou-frou" implies overly fussy,
frilled or heavily decorated, as with lace, ruffles, or
ribbons. "Chichi" is trendy, in an ostentatious way.

At one time "Chi-Chi" was used to describe the speech and habits of
Anglo-Indians in the sense of those with both ancestries. In that sense,
it's rather non-PC.

[Mike Lyle]

Post by James Silverton

Post by Barbara Bailey

Post by Berkeley Brett
I wonder....
Is there a subtle difference between "frou frou" and "chichi"
that the *stylish* speaker of English should know? :P
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/frou-frou
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/chichi

In speaking about fashion, "frou-frou" implies overly fussy,
frilled or heavily decorated, as with lace, ruffles, or
ribbons. "Chichi" is trendy, in an ostentatious way.

At one time "Chi-Chi" was used to describe the speech and habits of
Anglo-Indians in the sense of those with both ancestries. In that
sense, it's rather non-PC.

I was thinking that, too. To the people themselves, too. The fashion
sense came so late into my life that I can't, I think, use it, and wince
slightly when others do. I assumed it was from the French, and OED
confirms that; but it surprised me by giving an example of the French
meaning from 1908, so I must have led a more sheltered life than I'd
imagined. Am I being vicariously over-sensitive, or should the word
still perhaps be used with caution?

[Tasha Miller]

Post by James Silverton

Post by Barbara Bailey

Post by Berkeley Brett
I wonder....
Is there a subtle difference between "frou frou" and "chichi"
that the *stylish* speaker of English should know? :P
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/frou-frou
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/chichi

In speaking about fashion, "frou-frou" implies overly fussy,
frilled or heavily decorated, as with lace, ruffles, or
ribbons. "Chichi" is trendy, in an ostentatious way.

At one time "Chi-Chi" was used to describe the speech and habits of
Anglo-Indians in the sense of those with both ancestries. In that
sense, it's rather non-PC.

This is the meaning I am familiar with so I wouldn't be comfortable using
it. I heard an elderly person use the word 'gypped' recently and Chi-Chi
raises a similar level of unease in me.

[Glenn Knickerbocker]

Post by Berkeley Brett
Is there a subtle difference between "frou frou" and "chichi"

Sure. Anything that's The New Black is chichi but simple.

¬R