Discussion:
Ukraine (pronunciation)
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Guy Barry
2014-08-16 08:49:25 UTC
Permalink
The standard BrE pronunciation of "Ukraine" is with the stress on the second
syllable, but I heard an American-accented speaker this morning stressing it
on the first. Is this just a pondial difference or something else?
--
Guy Barry
Steve Hayes
2014-08-16 11:38:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Guy Barry
The standard BrE pronunciation of "Ukraine" is with the stress on the second
syllable, but I heard an American-accented speaker this morning stressing it
on the first. Is this just a pondial difference or something else?
I've only heard the second, when people pronounce it as You-crane. I believe
native speakers pronounce it with the stress on the third syllable "Oo cry EE
na"
--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://khanya.wordpress.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk
James Silverton
2014-08-16 12:13:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Hayes
Post by Guy Barry
The standard BrE pronunciation of "Ukraine" is with the stress on the second
syllable, but I heard an American-accented speaker this morning stressing it
on the first. Is this just a pondial difference or something else?
I've only heard the second, when people pronounce it as You-crane. I believe
native speakers pronounce it with the stress on the third syllable "Oo cry EE
na"
Since just "Ukraine" with two syllables is not the native pronunciation,
it suggests that the older use
"The Ukraine" might be quite legitimate.
--
Jim Silverton (Potomac, MD)

Extraneous "not." in Reply To.
Guy Barry
2014-08-16 13:55:12 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 16 Aug 2014 09:49:25 +0100, "Guy Barry"
Post by Guy Barry
The standard BrE pronunciation of "Ukraine" is with the stress on the second
syllable, but I heard an American-accented speaker this morning stressing it
on the first. Is this just a pondial difference or something else?
I've only heard the second, when people pronounce it as You-crane. I believe
native speakers pronounce it with the stress on the third syllable "Oo cry EE
na"
Since just "Ukraine" with two syllables is not the native pronunciation, it
suggests that the older use
"The Ukraine" might be quite legitimate.
Since the name in Ukrainian is not "Ukraine" but "Ukrayina"
(transliterated), all of this is irrelevant. I was asking about the English
name.
--
Guy Barry
Wayne Brown
2014-08-19 17:40:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Hayes
Post by Guy Barry
The standard BrE pronunciation of "Ukraine" is with the stress on the second
syllable, but I heard an American-accented speaker this morning stressing it
on the first. Is this just a pondial difference or something else?
I've only heard the second, when people pronounce it as You-crane. I believe
native speakers pronounce it with the stress on the third syllable "Oo cry EE
na"
I've only ever heard the stress on the second syllable, and the same
for the adjective "Ukrainian."
--
F. Wayne Brown <***@bellsouth.net>

Þæs ofereode, ðisses swa mæg. ("That passed away, this also can.")
from "Deor," in the Exeter Book (folios 100r-100v)
Jerry Friedman
2014-08-22 15:57:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wayne Brown
Post by Steve Hayes
Post by Guy Barry
The standard BrE pronunciation of "Ukraine" is with the stress on the second
syllable, but I heard an American-accented speaker this morning stressing it
on the first. Is this just a pondial difference or something else?
I've only heard the second, when people pronounce it as You-crane. I believe
native speakers pronounce it with the stress on the third syllable "Oo cry EE
na"
I've only ever heard the stress on the second syllable, and the same
for the adjective "Ukrainian."
I've heard the stress on the first syllable, including from an NPR
announcer.
--
Jerry Friedman
Robert Bannister
2014-08-23 02:15:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jerry Friedman
On Sat, 16 Aug 2014 06:38:05 in article
On Sat, 16 Aug 2014 09:49:25 +0100, "Guy Barry"
Post by Guy Barry
The standard BrE pronunciation of "Ukraine" is with the stress on the second
syllable, but I heard an American-accented speaker this morning stressing it
on the first. Is this just a pondial difference or something else?
I've only heard the second, when people pronounce it as You-crane. I believe
native speakers pronounce it with the stress on the third syllable "Oo cry EE
na"
I've only ever heard the stress on the second syllable, and the same
for the adjective "Ukrainian."
I've heard the stress on the first syllable, including from an NPR
announcer.
Must be pondial then. It would sound weird enough to me that I might not
understand it first time. The main variation I hear is
You-crane-yun and You-crine-yun.
--
Robert Bannister - 1940-71 SE England
1972-now W Australia
Guy Barry
2014-08-23 09:36:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Bannister
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Wayne Brown
I've only ever heard the stress on the second syllable, and the same
for the adjective "Ukrainian."
I've heard the stress on the first syllable, including from an NPR
announcer.
For "Ukrainian" as well as "Ukraine"?
Post by Robert Bannister
Must be pondial then. It would sound weird enough to me that I might not
understand it first time. The main variation I hear is
You-crane-yun and You-crine-yun.
I've never heard any vowel other than the "crane" vowel.
--
Guy Barry
Peter Moylan
2014-08-23 11:35:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Guy Barry
Post by Robert Bannister
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Wayne Brown
I've only ever heard the stress on the second syllable, and the same
for the adjective "Ukrainian."
I've heard the stress on the first syllable, including from an NPR
announcer.
For "Ukrainian" as well as "Ukraine"?
Post by Robert Bannister
Must be pondial then. It would sound weird enough to me that I might
not understand it first time. The main variation I hear is
You-crane-yun and You-crine-yun.
I've never heard any vowel other than the "crane" vowel.
I sometimes pronounce it with third-syllable stress, as you-cra-EEN. I
can't explain to myself why I do that, because it still doesn't match
the native pronunciation.
--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Jerry Friedman
2014-08-23 13:37:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Guy Barry
Post by Jerry Friedman
Post by Wayne Brown
I've only ever heard the stress on the second syllable, and the same
for the adjective "Ukrainian."
I've heard the stress on the first syllable, including from an NPR
announcer.
For "Ukrainian" as well as "Ukraine"?
...

No, just for "Ukraine".
--
Jerry Friedman
Peter T. Daniels
2014-08-16 15:01:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Guy Barry
The standard BrE pronunciation of "Ukraine" is with the stress on the second
syllable, but I heard an American-accented speaker this morning stressing it
on the first. Is this just a pondial difference or something else?
Was it followed by a word with primary stress on the first syllable?

Stress shift is very common in that situation in names. I first noticed
it in "CorNELL University" vs. "CORnell Glee Club" and "CORnell Avenue"
in the Chicago neighborhood of Hyde park.
Guy Barry
2014-08-16 15:06:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter T. Daniels
Post by Guy Barry
The standard BrE pronunciation of "Ukraine" is with the stress on the second
syllable, but I heard an American-accented speaker this morning stressing it
on the first. Is this just a pondial difference or something else?
Was it followed by a word with primary stress on the first syllable?
No, he pronounced it like that throughout the interview.
--
Guy Barry
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