Discussion:
What is the opposite of namesake?
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micky
2015-06-26 20:20:17 UTC
Permalink
What is the opposite of namesake?

Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.

But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?

The anti-namesake? The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
--
Please say where you live, or what
area's English you are asking about.
So your question or answer makes sense.
. .
I have lived all my life in the USA,
Western Pa. Indianapolis, Chicago,
Brooklyn, Baltimore.
Horace LaBadie
2015-06-26 20:53:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake? The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
Eponym.
Peter T. Daniels
2015-06-26 21:00:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Horace LaBadie
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake? The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
Eponym.
But can that be said of people? Bloomers have (or not?) Amelia Bloomer as
their eponym, but does George Washington Carver have George Washington as
his eponym?
Horace LaBadie
2015-06-26 21:16:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter T. Daniels
Post by Horace LaBadie
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake? The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
Eponym.
But can that be said of people? Bloomers have (or not?) Amelia Bloomer as
their eponym, but does George Washington Carver have George Washington as
his eponym?
Why not? Seems like a natural extension of the term.
Traddict
2015-06-27 15:26:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Horace LaBadie
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake? The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
Eponym.
+1

Incidentally, the same word exists in French ("éponyme"), but it is often
misused for "homonym" or even "namesake".
q***@yahoo.com
2015-06-26 20:57:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake? The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
Model. Paradigm. Antenomen. Onomaster. Namesook.

(Just how do you set up those "fund me" thingies?)
--
John
Whiskers
2015-06-26 22:31:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake? The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
I'd say 'namesake' for all these meanings:

person for (or 'after') whom another is named

person who has been named after (or 'for') another

someone coincidentally having the same name as another.
--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2015-06-27 06:24:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake? The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
It seems to me that we would so rarely have a use for such a word that
we have no need of it.
--
athel
micky
2015-06-27 15:03:35 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 27 Jun 2015 08:24:10 +0200, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake?
I misspelled t his. I meant antenamesake. I knew it looked wrong at
the time but didn't know why.
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by micky
The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
It seems to me that we would so rarely have a use for such a word that
we have no need of it.
You may be right.
--
Please say where you live, or what
area's English you are asking about.
So your question or answer makes sense.
. .
I have lived all my life in the USA,
Western Pa. Indianapolis, Chicago,
Brooklyn, Baltimore.
Horace LaBadie
2015-06-27 15:46:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by micky
On Sat, 27 Jun 2015 08:24:10 +0200, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake?
I misspelled t his. I meant antenamesake. I knew it looked wrong at
the time but didn't know why.
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by micky
The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
It seems to me that we would so rarely have a use for such a word that
we have no need of it.
You may be right.
And yet the Greeks felt the need for eponym. Weird.
Peter Duncanson [BrE]
2015-06-27 16:32:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Horace LaBadie
Post by micky
On Sat, 27 Jun 2015 08:24:10 +0200, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake?
I misspelled t his. I meant antenamesake. I knew it looked wrong at
the time but didn't know why.
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by micky
The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
It seems to me that we would so rarely have a use for such a word that
we have no need of it.
You may be right.
And yet the Greeks felt the need for eponym. Weird.
What was the name of that girl from Eponyma? Ay, yes, Eponyma.
--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)
Robert Bannister
2015-06-27 23:56:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Duncanson [BrE]
Post by Horace LaBadie
Post by micky
On Sat, 27 Jun 2015 08:24:10 +0200, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake?
I misspelled t his. I meant antenamesake. I knew it looked wrong at
the time but didn't know why.
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by micky
The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
It seems to me that we would so rarely have a use for such a word that
we have no need of it.
You may be right.
And yet the Greeks felt the need for eponym. Weird.
What was the name of that girl from Eponyma? Ay, yes, Eponyma.
Aah.
--
Robert Bannister
Perth, Western Australia
Sneaky O. Possum
2015-06-27 18:26:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Horace LaBadie
Post by micky
On Sat, 27 Jun 2015 08:24:10 +0200, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake?
I misspelled t his. I meant antenamesake. I knew it looked wrong at
the time but didn't know why.
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by micky
The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
It seems to me that we would so rarely have a use for such a word
that we have no need of it.
You may be right.
And yet the Greeks felt the need for eponym. Weird.
I think we were the ones who felt the need - 'eponym' seems to be a
19th-century English coinage derived from Classical Greek 'eponymos,'
i.e., 'given as a name'.
--
S.O.P.
Jerry Friedman
2015-06-28 15:31:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by micky
On Sat, 27 Jun 2015 08:24:10 +0200, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake?
I misspelled t his. I meant antenamesake. I knew it looked wrong at
the time but didn't know why.
...

I think "anti" is fine. It's like "type" and "antitype" in some
Christian styles of Biblical interpretation.
--
Jerry Friedman
Traddict
2015-06-28 17:36:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by micky
On Sat, 27 Jun 2015 08:24:10 +0200, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake?
I misspelled t his. I meant
antenamesake.
"Antenamesake" would mean "before the namesake", so it could refer to that
which gives rise to the namesake. Indeed, that would be the opposite of
"antinamesake" in the sense that you mean (= "eponym"), which refers to what
the namesake gives rise to.
Post by micky
I knew it looked wrong at
the time but didn't know why.
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by micky
The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
It seems to me that we would so rarely have a use for such a word that
we have no need of it.
You may be right.
--
Please say where you live, or what
area's English you are asking about.
So your question or answer makes sense.
. .
I have lived all my life in the USA,
Western Pa. Indianapolis, Chicago,
Brooklyn, Baltimore.
Mike L
2015-06-28 20:10:13 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 27 Jun 2015 08:24:10 +0200, Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
Post by micky
What is the opposite of namesake?
Jefferson Davis was, iiuic, the namesake of Thomas Jefferson.
But what was Thomas Jefferson to Jefferson Davis?
The anti-namesake? The retro-namesake? The name foresaker? The
sakename? Or is there no word for that?
It seems to me that we would so rarely have a use for such a word that
we have no need of it.
I think the relationship is reciprocal...yes (beat Peter to it!) ,
here's OED:
<A person who or thing which has the same name as another.>
And a Browne fan can't resist this example:
<1646 Sir T. Browne Pseudodoxia Epidemica 170 Nor [does] the
Dog-fish at sea much more make out the Dog of the land, then that his
cognominall or name-sake in the heavens.>
--
Mike.
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